Vaccines are NOT safe for children - Page 3

Riot · #41 07-07-2010, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Autism up.[B

Cancers up.[/b] Cardiovascular 'disease' up. Obesity up. Psych problems up and on and on and on it goes. Anyone with any foresight can see the direction things are headed.

Anyone with some objectivity - rather than fear and rumor - can put it in perspective.

Quote:

WEDNESDAY, July 7 (HealthDay News) -- The number of deaths due to cancer continues to decline in the United States, according to new statistics from the American Cancer Society.

In fact, the downward trend, which began in the early 1990s, means about 767,000 fewer deaths from cancer over the past two decades, according to society estimates.

The report finds that the death rate from cancer overall in the United States in 2007 was 178.4 per 100,000 people -- a drop of 1.3 percent from the previous year.

This decline continues a trend that started in 1991 for men and in 1992 for women. Since that time, death rates have fallen 21 percent among men and 12 percent among women, the report says.

"Cancer death rates continue to decrease because of prevention, early detection and improved treatment," said lead researcher Dr. Ahmedin Jemal, the strategic director for cancer occurrence at the society.

"The decline in cancer incidence and mortality among the U.S. population is a positive sign that public health campaigns and public policy regarding smoking, and greater utilization of and stricter guidelines for cancer screenings are working," agreed Monique N. Hernandez, a senior research analyst at the Florida Cancer Data System at the University of Miami Miller School of Medicine.

For 2010, the cancer society predicts 1,529,560 new cancer cases (789,620 in men and 739,940 in women) and 569,490 cancer deaths (299,200 in men and 270,290 in women).

As before, lung cancer remains the biggest cancer killer of both men and women. For men, the next biggest killers are cancers of the prostate and colon. For women, breast and colon that are the second and third most lethal cancers by number.

Overall, these cancers account for 50 percent of all cancer deaths among men and women, the report found

And while cancer is on the retreat, the good news hasn't affected all Americans equally. Indeed, the report found that black men are 14 percent more likely to get cancer and 34 percent more likely to die than white men, while black women have a 7 percent lower cancer rate overall but are 17 percent more likely to die than white women.

To help eliminate those disparities, Hernandez believes that experts and policymakers "must move beyond traditional behavioral explanations, such as individual smoking habits and screening utilization, and encompass aspects of the social, political, and economic contexts of health, which are also heavily variable by geography."

Of course that last part feeds into Obama's socialist, government-run death panel health care government telling us what to do regarding health. Who will they come for, first?

Honu · #42 07-07-2010, 11:06 PM

You know why the hell does anyone need the government to tell them what is good or not what is healthy or not. There is enough information out there from doctors and just basic common sense that it just seems absurd to me that we need the federal government to tell us what is what . Is there not anyone who cant think for themselves and make choices to live? Really how dumb are we that we need a government run agency or program to tell us that smoking, eating till your gut is stuffed and drinking all day and night is bad. I guess I just wonder how far the good in all the governments care for us will go, will they some day decide that if you partake of some of the bad things that you wont be eligible for their health care? Just wondering.
If it hasnt dawned on anyone Americans are choosing to eat fast food and fatten their kids up because they are lazy, they have no desire to buy whole foods and cook them so who gives a sh it that they want to kill themselves let them die less of a burden on the sysytem. Really it doesnt take a rocket scientist or a governement agency for people to know that they are fat lazy azzes and choose to be that way so let em, so far its a free country.

Indian Charlie · #43 07-07-2010, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot

Anyone with some objectivity - rather than fear and rumor - can put it in perspective.

Of course that last part feeds into Obama's socialist, government-run death panel health care government telling us what to do regarding health. Who will they come for, first?

Yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, right.

That's why cancer rate projections are through the roof.

Current day cancer rates are much higher than they were 20 years ago, even you know that.

By the way, that 'lower' mortality rate the ACS is trumping up, that only looks at short term survival. Long term survival, that is beyond five years after treatment, is catastrophically low.

I love the approach modern medicine uses to kill cancer. Use radiation and chemicals that cause cancer, to kill cancer. Makes a ton of sense.

Back to vaccines Riot. Can you tell me why they used a mercury based preservative in vaccines?

hi_im_god · #44 07-08-2010, 12:20 AM

bad teeth and germs killed a lot more people over the last thousand years than any imagined vaccine conspiracy.

i'll try to be positive and appreciate that no one has yet come on to cite the downside of soap.

we all stand at the current pinnacle of human life expectancy. it wasn't superstition or personal testimonial that got us here. we gave up that demon haunted world for this one.

Indian Charlie · #45 07-08-2010, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

bad teeth and germs killed a lot more people over the last thousand years than any imagined vaccine conspiracy.

i'll try to be positive and appreciate that no one has yet come on to cite the downside of soap.

we all stand at the current pinnacle of human life expectancy. it wasn't superstition or personal testimonial that got us here. we gave up that demon haunted world for this one.

That's all great, but with improvements in sanitation, these killer germs were already greatly diminished in the amount of people they killed. Fact, death rates frequently went back up when a vaccine for that disease was introduced.

You are also wrong about life expectancy, if you are big enough to factor out infant mortality rates, which admittedly, is no small thing.

Basically, if you survived past ten 100 years ago, you were likely to outlive yourself today.

And finally, what imagined vaccine conspiracy are you referring to? The one where vaccines work?

How do you know vaccines really do work anyways? Have you done any looking into the matter at all, or are you just saying that out of some knee jerk reaction that the powers that be really do care for our well being?

When faced with ugly truths, it's real easy to dismiss things with a shrug and say "nah, that can't be true".

Rupert Pupkin · #46 07-08-2010, 06:50 PM

In general, I'm not big on vaccines. Based on everything I've read and the anecdotal stories I've heard, my guess is that some of these vaccines do more harm than good. However, some vaccines are very important. For example, I've heard it is very important to immunize horses with the West Nile vaccine.

It's not often that I would ask for Riot's opinion but she could probably shed some light on the importance of the West Nile Vaccine for horses.

I'm not so sure about some of the other vaccines. Most vets recommend giving your young pets one of those 6 in 1 vaccines that contain 6 different vaccines in one shot. The truth of the matter is that they don't know the long-term effects of these vaccines. If you give your puppy one of these vaccines and he ends up dying of cancer 10 years later, how can they tell if there is a link or not. It's possible that the vaccine could cause cancer many years later.

I don't belive in flu shots. I've never gotten a flu shot in my life and I never get the flu. The people I know that get flu shots seem to be the ones that end up getting the flu. And it is a fact that people sometimes have adverse reactions to these shots.

I guess it's all about risk/reward. But I think that people should do their own homework on these things. There are so many things that the government has told us are safe and then years later we find out that they're not safe. Let's take cell-phone use for example. There are tons of studies that say it is safe. But there are many other studies that say it is dangerous. I would rather be safe than sorry. I try to limit my cell-phone use.

Cannon Shell · #47 07-08-2010, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I would rather be safe than sorry. I try to limit my cell-phone use.

Reading too many threads on Derbytrail will make you want to limit your internet use.

Riot · #48 07-08-2010, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, right.

That's why cancer rate projections are through the roof.

Current day cancer rates are much higher than they were 20 years ago, even you know that.

By the way, that 'lower' mortality rate the ACS is trumping up, that only looks at short term survival. Long term survival, that is beyond five years after treatment, is catastrophically low.

I love the approach modern medicine uses to kill cancer. Use radiation and chemicals that cause cancer, to kill cancer. Makes a ton of sense.

Back to vaccines Riot. Can you tell me why they used a mercury based preservative in vaccines?

Quote:

Indian Charlie wrote:
I myself am fully immersed in the thimerisol topic, as I've had my entire life dealing with its side effects.

And you don't know? Strange. Perhaps you should immerse yourself more deeply

Riot · #49 07-08-2010, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

In general, I'm not big on vaccines. Based on everything I've read and the anecdotal stories I've heard, my guess is that some of these vaccines do more harm than good. However, some vaccines are very important. For example, I've heard it is very important to immunize horses with the West Nile vaccine.

It's not often that I would ask for Riot's opinion but she could probably shed some light on the importance of the West Nile Vaccine for horses.

I'm not so sure about some of the other vaccines. Most vets recommend giving your young pets one of those 6 in 1 vaccines that contain 6 different vaccines in one shot. The truth of the matter is that they don't know the long-term effects of these vaccines. If you give your puppy one of these vaccines and he ends up dying of cancer 10 years later, how can they tell if there is a link or not. It's possible that the vaccine could cause cancer many years later.

I don't belive in flu shots. I've never gotten a flu shot in my life and I never get the flu. The people I know that get flu shots seem to be the ones that end up getting the flu. And it is a fact that people sometimes have adverse reactions to these shots.

I guess it's all about risk/reward. But I think that people should do their own homework on these things. There are so many things that the government has told us are safe and then years later we find out that they're not safe. Let's take cell-phone use for example. There are tons of studies that say it is safe. But there are many other studies that say it is dangerous. I would rather be safe than sorry. I try to limit my cell-phone use.

West Nile (the encephalities) - easy to prevent, appropriate to do so. In the past 20 years, we've spread just about every disease, everywhere, as we are such a nationally and internationally mobile society. So distance no longer protects as it used to.

I fully believe in aggressive appropriate immunization - and fully believe in not over-immunizing. Each animal (and human) is different. Pediatrics (human and animal) are different than adults, and than geriatrics. Vaccines differ in their efficacy. I use plain killed virus vaccines, modified live virus, bacterins, DNA-vectored, subunit vaccines, etc. They are all different, in how they work, what side effects are possible, etc. Vaccines are SO different from what they were 20 years ago, even 8-5 years ago. Much improved. Not alot to fear, nowadays, really. Diseases vary in their morbidity and mortality. Protect those that need it, from that which you can and should. I've never been a fan of "one size fits all" for immunization schedules, and I absolutely do not believe in vaccinating just because some drug company made a vaccine and is looking for a market.

PS - as it stands now, you are right on the phone

Indian Charlie · #50 07-09-2010, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot

And you don't know? Strange. Perhaps you should immerse yourself more deeply

Of course I know.

Of course you knew that, but as usual, you had to answer a serious question with an evasion.

Having a discussion with you has got to be the single most pointless endeavor I've ever attempted.

Riot · #51 07-09-2010, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Of course I know.

Of course you knew that, but as usual, you had to answer a serious question with an evasion.

Having a discussion with you has got to be the single most pointless endeavor I've ever attempted.

You're just as bad as they say you are.

hi_im_god · #52 07-09-2010, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot

You're just as bad as they say you are.

fruit of the poisoned tree!

just wanted to see how that felt.

it feels...

dumb.

Danzig · #53 07-10-2010, 11:35 AM

these threads should be limited to those with extensive college education and plenty of objectivity. the unwashed masses have only fear and stupidity to offer...obviously, those people should be the first to be visited by death panels.