evangelicals vs romney, mormonism

[Danzig]

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/us...eological.html

for one, we supposedly don't have a religious test in this country to hold public office. of course we all know that some like to inject religion where it doesn't belong-in this case the election. a re-tread of the days when some were horrified at the thought of a (gasp) papist taking office when john kennedy was running to become the first roman catholic in the oval office. i'd take the stand that we survived that just fine.

now, when people like to start discussing 'my religion versus yours', i usually think and then say the same thing. they all require a suspension of disbelief, they all are based on faith and not reason. to me no one is better than any other. in other words, i find it silly.
this counry isn't a theocracy-i hope it never, ever becomes one.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Danzig

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/us...eological.html

for one, we supposedly don't have a religious test in this country to hold public office. of course we all know that some like to inject religion where it doesn't belong-in this case the election. a re-tread of the days when some were horrified at the thought of a (gasp) papist taking office when john kennedy was running to become the first roman catholic in the oval office. i'd take the stand that we survived that just fine.

now, when people like to start discussing 'my religion versus yours', i usually think and then say the same thing. they all require a suspension of disbelief, they all are based on faith and not reason. to me no one is better than any other. in other words, i find it silly.
this counry isn't a theocracy-i hope it never, ever becomes one.

it's an interesting theological debate. mormon's are handicapped by being a religion formed within the last 150 years so there are lots of available historical documents to fact check. the records are a little sketchier going back 2000 years.

a guy dictating scripture from a hat filled with magic rocks about jesus coming to north america and native american's being the lost tribe of israel still sounds silly when it hasn't been repeated to hundred's of generations.

it's why scientologists are really screwed.

politically, it only comes into play if the small number of evangelical voters that would sit out a obama-romney election matter in a state like florida or virginia.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

politically, it only comes into play if the small number of evangelical voters that would sit out a obama-romney election matter in a state like florida or virginia.

I'm shocked that the evangelicals threw all their support behind Rick Santorum, rather than Perry. Although it took three ballots to get there, so certainly wasn't overwhelming.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Riot

I'm shocked that the evangelicals threw all their support behind Rick Santorum, rather than Perry. Although it took three ballots to get there, so certainly wasn't overwhelming.

no one outside the democratic party wants to see a obama-perry debate and i don't think anyone thinks perry could get elected dodging one.

but the endorsement of a non-factor like santorum speaks volumes about the reduction of evangelical influence in the republican party.

being an evangelical republican is starting to be like being a black democrat.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

but the endorsement of a non-factor like santorum speaks volumes about the reduction of evangelical influence in the republican party.

Citizens United ensured the power and ownership would stay with the right people. Right now it is not the voters, it is three billionaires, and their SuperPacs, controlling who is a presidential candidate, remaining in the race.

And some people laugh at Occupy. Occupy is so hated and crushed because they are citizens with a clear-eyed view, who won't stand for it anymore. They want their country, their democracy, back. Even the Wyoming State Supreme Court, the heart of Red Conservative Land, just voted that Citizens United cannot stand in their state.

[Riot]

Who controls this country? A very long, and interesting, article:

If the dead can’t vote in Chicago, should they be allowed to influence politics from the grave in Pittsburgh and Denver and New York?

The Koch brothers may be the most visible part of the Dead Billionaires club, but they are not the only New Deal-hating Libertarian elites funding the dismantling of the government of the United States from within.

A handful of the wealthiest families in America, all of whose great wealth dates back at least one American generation. They are 100% responsible for the political gridlock that is tearing America apart. The media touts this as a recent phenomenon, but it is part of a more than 40 year campaign by the Pre-New Deal robber barons and their offspring to end the social safety net, end union labor, and return America to the Right, white control of the early Industrial Age.

“They took the long view, investing to build institutions that might take a decade or more to mature. They also adopted a broad agenda that went far beyond business and economics to include such subjects as foreign policy, law, religion, history and even cultural criticism, “ James Pierson, Executive Director of the John M. Olin Foundation, a Dead Billionaire’s Club VIP organization, wrote of the top members of the “club.” [1]

Were it not for the millions that they pour into the political system, their far-Right Libertarian agenda would be voiceless and invisible.

The Dead Billionaires Club are a fraction of a fraction. Not even 1% of the 1%. Yet, because of the billions they hold, and the millions that their families have put into “charitable” foundations, long after the scions of the family are gone and dead, guys like Fred Koch and Adolph Coors are still able to affect modern politics from the Great Beyond by dominating the Republican Party’s funding stream, and influencing a large part of the corporate-owned media.

Etc. etc.

http://truth-2-power.com/2011/12/13/...uld-they-give/

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

it's an interesting theological debate. mormon's are handicapped by being a religion formed within the last 150 years so there are lots of available historical documents to fact check. the records are a little sketchier going back 2000 years.

a guy dictating scripture from a hat filled with magic rocks about jesus coming to north america and native american's being the lost tribe of israel still sounds silly when it hasn't been repeated to hundred's of generations.

it's why scientologists are really screwed.

politically, it only comes into play if the small number of evangelical voters that would sit out a obama-romney election matter in a state like florida or virginia.

yep, it sounds silly...but really no sillier than talking snakes, spirits knocking up women, people forced to undergo untold suffering so god can win a bet, etc etc

[Riot]

NYTimes editorial today: holy crap ...

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/op...ml?_r=1&src=tp

[Danzig]

http://www.ushistory.org/paine/reason/reason1.htm


I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my own church.

All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.