Ron Santo

[Scav]

It is absolutely RIDICULOUS that he is not in the HOF. This guy has done more for baseball, as a player and as an ambassador of the Cubs then 95% of the people that have played this friggin game. If anyone has heard him on the radio, he is absolutely hilarious, especially the one time his tuppee caught on fire at Shea Stadium.

And Joe Morgon, the guy is a complete jerkoff that sucked. Ryne Sandberg was ALWAYS a better 2nd baseman then this guy and STILL doesn't like Sandberg because he is also in the HOF. How he gets to speak and becomes a VP of whatever is beyond me.

Originally Posted by Scav

It is absolutely RIDICULOUS that he is not in the HOF. This guy has done more for baseball, as a player and as an ambassador of the Cubs then 95% of the people that have played this friggin game. If anyone has heard him on the radio, he is absolutely hilarious, especially the one time his tuppee caught on fire at Shea Stadium.

And Joe Morgon, the guy is a complete jerkoff that sucked. Ryne Sandberg was ALWAYS a better 2nd baseman then this guy and STILL doesn't like Sandberg because he is also in the HOF. How he gets to speak and becomes a VP of whatever is beyond me.

When I used to like baseball, Rhino was the man at 2nd. He was so incredibly smooth as a fielder... an absolute joy to watch. Santo... he was good. I will trust you on the good for baseball (and burning his scalp), but as a player I dont think Santo is HOF material. Morgan was very good. I dont think he was as good as Sanberg, but the big Red Machine championships do the talking.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by pgardn

When I used to like baseball, Rhino was the man at 2nd. He was so incredibly smooth as a fielder... an absolute joy to watch. Santo... he was good. I will trust you on the good for baseball (and burning his scalp), but as a player I dont think Santo is HOF material. Morgan was very good. I dont think he was as good as Sanberg, but the big Red Machine championships do the talking.

Santo has some of the best numbers that any 3rd baseman ever put up.

"A career .277 hitter, he won five Gold Gloves, and was a nine-time All-Star."

Lou Pinella "Santo was a dominant player at his position for a long, long time," Cubs manager Lou Piniella said. "An All-Star, Gold Glove winner, and a great ambassador in baseball. It's a shame he fell short."

Billy Williams and Ernie Banks need to get off their asses and start touting him becuase the other old ****s aren't gonna let him in when he is alive. I GUARANTEE you the second that he passes away, he will get in based on that fact alone. Why do people always wait to do something good until it is too late?

Santo Stat's

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/stats/hi...layerID=121697

Originally Posted by Scav

Santo has some of the best numbers that any 3rd baseman ever put up.

"A career .277 hitter, he won five Gold Gloves, and was a nine-time All-Star."

Lou Pinella "Santo was a dominant player at his position for a long, long time," Cubs manager Lou Piniella said. "An All-Star, Gold Glove winner, and a great ambassador in baseball. It's a shame he fell short."

Billy Williams and Ernie Banks need to get off their asses and start touting him becuase the other old ****s aren't gonna let him in when he is alive. I GUARANTEE you the second that he passes away, he will get in based on that fact alone. Why do people always wait to do something good until it is too late?

Santo Stat's

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/stats/hi...layerID=121697

Scavs you gotta love a guy who has Santo's consistency. But he does not fit with this group:

Frank Baker, George Brett, Jimmy Collins, George Kell, Pie Traynor, Brooks Robinson, Eddie Matthews, Freddie Linstrom, Wade Boggs..

And he would probably be the first to say so. Only Brooks has batting stats that are more in line with Santo, and my God no one in their right mind is going to say Santo fielded like Brooks Robinson.

Originally Posted by pgardn

Scavs you gotta love a guy who has Santo's consistency. But he does not fit with this group:

Frank Baker, George Brett, Jimmy Collins, George Kell, Pie Traynor, Brooks Robinson, Eddie Matthews, Freddie Linstrom, Wade Boggs..

And he would probably be the first to say so. Only Brooks has batting stats that are more in line with Santo, and my God no one in their right mind is going to say Santo fielded like Brooks Robinson.

Of this group, other than Robinson, NONE OF THEM could carry Santo's glove. He hit for power, was consistent day in and day out, and has been a great ambassador for baseball and a national spokesperson and poster boy for diabetes for years. As usual, baseball steps on its dick and makes yet another bad P.R. move by keeping Santo out of the Hall. Those HOF frauds that vote should have their selections made public.

[ddthetide]

Originally Posted by pgardn

When I used to like baseball, Rhino was the man at 2nd. He was so incredibly smooth as a fielder... an absolute joy to watch. Santo... he was good. I will trust you on the good for baseball (and burning his scalp), but as a player I dont think Santo is HOF material. Morgan was very good. I dont think he was as good as Sanberg, but the big Red Machine championships do the talking.

i'm a pirates fan and i had to watch the Big Red machine beat out my Bucs year after year. joe morgan was great player, every bit as good as sanburg. he gets lost because he played for those Reds. sanburg stood out because the cubs he played for were terrible!

[Crown@club]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Scavs you gotta love a guy who has Santo's consistency. But he does not fit with this group:

Frank Baker, George Brett, Jimmy Collins, George Kell, Pie Traynor, Brooks Robinson, Eddie Matthews, Freddie Linstrom, Wade Boggs..

And he would probably be the first to say so. Only Brooks has batting stats that are more in line with Santo, and my God no one in their right mind is going to say Santo fielded like Brooks Robinson.

.......And it took Brooks 8 more seasons to reach that line than Santo.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by DDthetide

i'm a pirates fan and i had to watch the Big Red machine beat out my Bucs year after year. joe morgan was great player, every bit as good as sanburg. he gets lost because he played for those Reds. sanburg stood out because the cubs he played for were terrible!

You are looking at it the wrong way. Look at the numbers that Sandburg put up with the people he was surrounded with. Look at Morgan and who was surrounding by and you will have your answer. Morgan is probably one of the biggest jerkoff's in baseball. He 'hated' Ryne Sandberg, hated him, even to go as far as not acknowledging his HOF nomination on ESPN because he wanted to still bask in some glory. I am not sure if there is a TON of 2nd Basemens or what, but it was BS. You put Sandburg on that team that Morgan was on, and he is possibly one of the best players of ALL TIME. Ryno was the COMPLETE package, he was serious in the field and had a high batting average, then threw in HR's and RBI's, changed and advanced the postiton 30 fold...

Originally Posted by Crown@club

.......And it took Brooks 8 more seasons to reach that line than Santo.

Brooks played 8 more seasons then Santo and had the same numbers? If that is the case I might go on a hunger strike in two years, protest the HOF in Cooperstown

[Crown@club]

Santo 15 seasons
8143 AB
1138 Runs
2254 Hits
342 HRS
1331 RBI
OBP .362
SLG .464
BA .277

Brooks 23 seasons
10654 AB
1232 Runs
2848 Hits
268 HRS
1357 RBIs
OBP .322
SLG .401
BA .267

See you in Cooperstown Scavs!!!!

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Crown@club

Santo 15 seasons
8143 AB
1138 Runs
2254 Hits
342 HRS
1331 RBI
OBP .362
SLG .464
BA .277

Brooks 23 seasons
10654 AB
1232 Runs
2848 Hits
268 HRS
1357 RBIs
OBP .322
SLG .401
BA .267

See you in Cooperstown Scavs!!!!

That is absolutely sickening. Better in HR's, OBP, SLG, BA and Brooks has EIGHT MORE YEARS, which is why by default he would have more AB, Runs, Hits, RBI's...it is amazing that Santo had more HR's then him, with 8 years less

So what goes into a hunger strike? Don't you climb on top of a billboard and bring signs and stuff and sit up there until he gets voted in??

Yes, Ron Santo was above-average performer in his era. But, his stats don't scream Cooperstown. Less than 2300 hits in 15 seasons at hot corner. Plus, his fielding while workmanlike was not as spectacular as Brooksie.

Doug Rader won 5 consecutive Gold Gloves at 3rd base. I don't think die-hard Astro fan (me) would suggest he belongs in HOF either.

Yes, I agree Ron Santo is great spokesperson for Cubs and baseball. But, he is seeking election as PLAYER here not as Cub ambassador-at-large.

[Cannon Shell]

You guys aren't seriously saying that Ryne Sandberg was a better baseball player than Joe Morgan are you?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scav

That is absolutely sickening. Better in HR's, OBP, SLG, BA and Brooks has EIGHT MORE YEARS, which is why by default he would have more AB, Runs, Hits, RBI's...it is amazing that Santo had more HR's then him, with 8 years less

So what goes into a hunger strike? Don't you climb on top of a billboard and bring signs and stuff and sit up there until he gets voted in??

Santo played in Wrigley/Robinson in Memorial stadium which would certainly put Robinson at a big disadvantage

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You guys aren't seriously saying that Ryne Sandberg was a better baseball player than Joe Morgan are you?

Yes I am, and even with my bias many agree with me. Joe Morgan was a product of the environment, I could hit 15 HR's in the MLB with Bench, Rose, Perez, Concepcion hanging around me.

Sandburg had Mark Grace and a little Dawson

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Santo played in Wrigley/Robinson in Memorial stadium which would certainly put Robinson at a big disadvantage

8 years, that advantage is not 8 years, maybe 2 HR's a year extra to the ballpark.....

[PeteMugg]

Rizzuto and Mazeroski in ... Hodges and Santo out. I'm not sure what the criteria is.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Scav

Yes I am, and even with my bias many agree with me. Joe Morgan was a product of the environment, I could hit 15 HR's in the MLB with Bench, Rose, Perez, Concepcion hanging around me.

Sandburg had Mark Grace and a little Dawson

Morgan is clearly the best modern day 2nd baseman. He was a great leadoff hitter, was the best baserunner in an era where stealing was important, and was great defensive player. All of which have nothing to do with who plays for your team.

[Scav]

The fact that I want to convey that IN HIS TIME, he was probably the best 3rd baseman playing...I don't all that played in that time, and would listen to people trying to argue others that played in his 'era' but those stats deserve the HOF. ALL THE WHILE playing with diabetes that he never leaked out.

The reason he isn't in is because he has pissed off some old timers with remarks that I have never even heard, and probably becuase all those old timers have no more fans, and Santo has even GROWN BIGGER in the radio market.....Him and Pat Hughes are absolutely outstanding, not a better radio team as far as enjoyment and play by play (Hughes). Hughes alone should get some sort of award for always having to keep Santo from going on a tangent (ala Harry Carry)

[Scav]

Originally Posted by PeteMugg

Rizzuto and Mazeroski in ... Hodges and Santo out. I'm not sure what the criteria is.

Mazeroski, a perfect EXAMPLE....

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Morgan is clearly the best modern day 2nd baseman. He was a great leadoff hitter, was the best baserunner in an era where stealing was important, and was great defensive player. All of which have nothing to do with who plays for your team.

While it is hard to argue because both players meant different things to their teams, Sandburg was clearly a better all around player. HE WON games on his own when the Cubs sucked. He WON GAMES HIMSELF in a team sport. He was a SMALL notch below defensively, and probably better then Morgan towards the end of his career, but offensively, you will not convince me otherwise that Morgen was better, not a chance