Big Truck - NY bred

[sumitas]

He is a "true" NY bred in that his sire Hook And Ladder is NY based. He is now the #1 leading sire in NY after Big Truck's win. There are so many "NY breds" that are conceived outside NY but dropped in NY, making them a NY bred.
http://www.nybreds.com/frames/FS_foalbarn.html

You can see "NY breds" by Kitten's Joy, Pulpit, Giacamo, Smarty Jones etc, etc. Makes it kind of tough to compete for NY breeders that use NY based stallions.

That must partly be a reason for sires like Utopia, Andromeda's Hero, Golden Missile, Smooth Jazz etc to locate to NY. Local breeders need access to compete with the carpet baggers.

[Bigsmc]

If you don't like the carpetbaggers, get the rules changed or put your mare on a van. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by sumitas

He is a "true" NY bred in that his sire Hook And Ladder is NY based. He is now the #1 leading sire in NY after Big Truck's win. There are so many "NY breds" that are conceived outside NY but dropped in NY, making them a NY bred.
http://www.nybreds.com/frames/FS_foalbarn.html

You can see "NY breds" by Kitten's Joy, Pulpit, Giacamo, Smarty Jones etc, etc. Makes it kind of tough to compete for NY breeders that use NY based stallions.

That must partly be a reason for sires like Utopia, Andromeda's Hero, Golden Missile, Smooth Jazz etc to locate to NY. Local breeders need access to compete with the carpet baggers.

You've got to be kidding with this.. For starters, the purses and awards, as well as NYRA's commitment to the NYB program, are outageously disproportionate to the quality of the racing. For that alone, the NY breeder should be grateful...

The monies made available to the poor, unfortunate "NY breeders that use NY based stallions" are STILL there after the 'carpetbagger' breeders' runners, who enhance the profile of the program, clear their NY bred conditions. It seems that at some point, every slow-moving NY bred barge manages to find a port...

IN POINT OF FACT... NY breeders who are using the NY sires should be grateful for the higher profile and more talented artificial NY breds as their presence in the program helps the muskrats amass earnings far out of whack with their talent by retaining NYB conditions LONGER.

[sumitas]

It's the NY taxpayer's money and it is mostly benefitting the upper echelon of racing which are out of staters. I don't see why NY money needs to subsidize out of state interests. If anything, the incentives could be cut and targeted for "true" NY breds, those sired and foaled in NY.

But that won't happen so "true" NY breds will have to continue to slam dunk the fakes.

[hoovesupsideyourhead]

inventor of the ny state bred turf sprint race........46k nw3x

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by sumitas

It's the NY taxpayer's money and it is mostly benefitting the upper echelon of racing which are out of staters. I don't see why NY money needs to subsidize out of state interests. If anything, the incentives could be cut and targeted for "true" NY breds, those sired and foaled in NY.

But that won't happen so "true" NY breds will have to continue to slam dunk the fakes.

I am not sure that people are going to get to excited watching "True NY Bred" blaze 6f's in 115.4..At least this way you have a shot to develop a Precise End and Freud.

[Holland Hacker]

Originally Posted by sumitas

He is a "true" NY bred in that his sire Hook And Ladder is NY based. He is now the #1 leading sire in NY after Big Truck's win. There are so many "NY breds" that are conceived outside NY but dropped in NY, making them a NY bred.
http://www.nybreds.com/frames/FS_foalbarn.html

You can see "NY breds" by Kitten's Joy, Pulpit, Giacamo, Smarty Jones etc, etc. Makes it kind of tough to compete for NY breeders that use NY based stallions.

That must partly be a reason for sires like Utopia, Andromeda's Hero, Golden Missile, Smooth Jazz etc to locate to NY. Local breeders need access to compete with the carpet baggers.

Isn't the idea of the NYB program to support the farms in New York state that breed horses?

I would think there are a lot of individuals employeed at farms in New York to care for all of the mares and their foals that they birth each year in New York regardless of where the stallion stands. I think letting mares breed outside of New York and allowing the resultant foal to qualify as NY Breds is a good thing. At a minimum it should improve the quality of NY bred racing if not he "class" of NY Breds.

NY will probably never compete with Kentucky for recruiting the top stallions but to prevent NY mares from breeding to them would be a disservice to NY Breeders and probably drive many breeders with top borderline mares to leave NY for greener pastures elsewhere. This would be a huge step backwards for the NY program as the qualify of NY Bred races would decline while the purses hopefully increase.

[sumitas]

The Big (NY) Truck is rollin now.

And notice in the link, if you want to, 3rd place finisher Dynamic Wayne is by NY based Eltish. So there.

http://www.nybreds.com/

You all make some good points and I understand your insight. #$%^(*&^%$#$%!!!

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by sumitas

The Big (NY) Truck is rollin now.

And notice in the link, if you want to, 3rd place finisher Dynamic Wayne is by NY based Eltish. So there.

http://www.nybreds.com/

You all make some good points and I understand your insight. #$%^(*&^%$#$%!!!

Don't forget about Spanky Fischbein (another Hook and Ladder.)

[sumitas]

I saw Hook And Ladder one time in the paddock at the spa. Kimmel was saddling him. As I recall he was slightly built.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by sumitas

I saw Hook And Ladder one time in the paddock at the spa. Kimmel was saddling him. As I recall he was slightly built.

He's a nice looking hoss IMO. Pretty 'racey' looking, but he seems to have a decent amount of bone and a nice shoulder.

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

There were quite a few horses at the two-year-olds in training sales last year by Hook and Ladder that could really run. Some of them are nice hosses.

[Cajungator26]

Sons of Dixieland Band seem to do OK at stud... I wonder how the Bowman's Band two year olds are going to look this year when they hit the track.

[sumitas]

Here's a neat bloodhorse comparison of the 2...
http://www.bloodhorse.com/stallion-r...s/default.aspx

note: Scroll down to the comparison section. If you enter Hook And Ladder you can then compare him to Bowmans Band, etc. Purty cool.

H & L has done well. He deserves credit. You'd think the Bowman's Band juvis should do well also. BB looks stockier than H&L.

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Hook and Ladder was a sire that I said to watch out for when I saw some of his offspring at the two-year-olds in training sales last year. Some of them are nice hosses.

AMEN

i hit a large ticket with I promise at belmont way back when
http://www.nybreds.com/racing/entrie...s_breeder.html

[pgiaco]

The NY State Breeding and Development Fund provides an incentive to breed to NY stallions. If you breed to a NY stallion your breeder/owner awards are 20% of purses earned, and if by an out of state stallion the award is 10% of purse earned. The breeder has the option of trying for the bigger breeder awards or higher quality stallions. There is nothing devious about the rules. They are very straightforward.

[SOREHOOF]

Are CalBreds any better?

[sumitas]

Thank you pgiaco. I am not an expert on any breeding rules and I appreciate your educating myself. That rule makes a whole lot of sense to me.

I'm here to learn not just shout.

[pgiaco]

Glad I can help, Sumitas. NY does a good job of trying to level the playing field as far as breeding goes. It sometimes is a difficult decision, Since I run some of my NY breds out of state I tend toward the KY stallions. But I have a couple of Catienus babies (before he left NY) and I am a fan of Freud and I'm sending a mare to Hook and Ladder this year.

[SOREHOOF]

Sunriver is standiing in N.Y.