Best 3 yr old in the country

gales0678 · #1 05-19-2009, 08:27 AM

Not counting the fillies if the vote was held today Mine That Bird would be my vote.

If he wins the Belmont , i don't see how that wouldn't lock up the title after that race - 2 wins and a second in the TC would have to make him a lock for 3 yr old colt of the year no?

Danzig · #2 05-19-2009, 08:36 AM

not necessarily. there are some good horses on the sidelines that could be heard from throughout the year. i'd say he's the front runner right now.

gales0678 · #3 05-19-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

not necessarily. there are some good horses on the sidelines that could be heard from throughout the year. i'd say he's the front runner right now.

who is going to beat him - if he wins two legs of the TC and a 2nd in the Preakness - expalin to me how he could not get it if the above plays out , aren't those 3 races the most important for 3 yr old colts for the year - he would have 2 wins and a 2nd

even if quality road comes back and wins the travers and a few other races - how would it be right for MTB not to get the award?

Danzig · #4 05-19-2009, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

who is going to beat him - if he wins two legs of the TC and a 2nd in the Preakness - expalin to me how he could not get it if the above plays out , aren't those 3 races the most important for 3 yr old colts for the year - he would have 2 wins and a 2nd

even if quality road comes back and wins the travers and a few other races - how would it be right for MTB not to get the award?

i'm not arguing right or wrong. but horses have won tc races, and then not got top 3 yo. that's why i'm saying it's not a lock. obviously he's the front runner now. besides, he has to win another tc race for the first part of your scenario to be factual.

as for quality road, or other horses who missed the spring classics, there are still plenty of races out there. there's taking on older horses in the fall, and of course the bcc.

gales0678 · #5 05-19-2009, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

i'm not arguing right or wrong. but horses have won tc races, and then not got top 3 yo. that's why i'm saying it's not a lock. obviously he's the front runner now. besides, he has to win another tc race for the first part of your scenario to be factual.

i know that my case is hinged on him winning the belmont , a tall order but , in my opinion winning 2 of 3 and running 2nd to a super filly in the 3rd leg should make him an automatic lock

if he doesn't get if the above plays out , it' an injustice - in my opinion

Danzig · #6 05-19-2009, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

i know that my case is hinged on him winning the belmont , a tall order but , in my opinion winning 2 of 3 and running 2nd to a super filly in the 3rd leg should make him an automatic lock

if he doesn't get if the above plays out , it' an injustice - in my opinion

it's may. you might want to see how the year unfolds before making your eclipse selections-that's all i'm saying. you might be thinking differently by years' end.

Antitrust32 · #7 05-19-2009, 09:01 AM

If he wins the belmont... and had some nads and the owners rushed him off to the shed like most horses that win 2 TC races he would be a LOCK for 3 yo colt.

If he wins the belmont but god forbid runs in races the rest of the year and does average I dont think he wins the 3yo colt title.

Its weird logic but than again the eclipse awards are a weird event.

the_fat_man · #8 05-19-2009, 09:03 AM

This is a very interesting case with this horse. He WASN't 'fast enough' to even be considered in the discussion a few weeks ago. Then, as luck would have it, he gets cut off out of the gate and the jock decides to ride him off the pace. And, all of a sudden, he BECOMES 'fast enough'. I'm thinking, whether he's top 3 year old (excluding RA) or not depends on whether or not he remains 'fast enough'.

Get my drift?

SniperSB23 · #9 05-19-2009, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

The only eclipse award that has been decided already is Rachel Alexandra as top 3 year old filly.

In 2007, we had a different winner of each triple crown race. If Rachel Alexandra doesn't go in the Belmont, it's possible we have the same thing this year. It wasn't until Curlin won the Classic that year, that he got the award that year.

Sure if Mine That Bird wins the Belmont he becomes the big favorite. But, what if he doesn't win another race the rest of the year? What if a another 3 year old wins the Jim Dandy, Travers, Jockey Club Gold Cup and Classic? Hard to deny the award to him won't it be?

Especially if that were Quality Road and the horse beat Mind that Bird head to head in at least one of those races.

gales0678 · #10 05-19-2009, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

The only eclipse award that has been decided already is Rachel Alexandra as top 3 year old filly.

In 2007, we had a different winner of each triple crown race. If Rachel Alexandra doesn't go in the Belmont, it's possible we have the same thing this year. It wasn't until Curlin won the Classic that year, that he got the award that year.

Sure if Mine That Bird wins the Belmont he becomes the big favorite. But, what if he doesn't win another race the rest of the year? What if a another 3 year old wins the Jim Dandy, Travers, Jockey Club Gold Cup and Classic? Hard to deny the award to him won't it be?

Jay help me please if a horse wins the KY derby by 7 , runs 2nd in the preakness beats all the colts and losses to a super filly , then comes back and wins the belmont stakes - how in the world can he not get the top 3 yr old of the year for colts - aren't those 3 races the most important of the year aren't they the races that everyone shoots for ?

Let me run this by you if QR comes back and wins the JD and travers then wins the Gold cup - and then doesn't race in the classic (i don't think JJ will send him to the west coast on the ploy) why wouldn't MTB get it over him even if MTB does nothing after winning the Belmont - please explain that to me - i don't get it

CSC · #11 05-19-2009, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is a very interesting case with this horse. He WASN't 'fast enough' to even be considered in the discussion a few weeks ago. Then, as luck would have it, he gets cut off out of the gate and the jock decides to ride him off the pace. And, all of a sudden, he BECOMES 'fast enough'. I'm thinking, whether he's top 3 year old (excluding RA) or not depends on whether or not he remains 'fast enough'.

Get my drift?

His beyers on synth were mediocre last yr, obviously he has improved since he moved to dirt coupled with a preferred late running style. Or the Woodbine beyers were off last yr...

blackthroatedwind · #12 05-19-2009, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is a very interesting case with this horse. He WASN't 'fast enough' to even be considered in the discussion a few weeks ago. Then, as luck would have it, he gets cut off out of the gate and the jock decides to ride him off the pace. And, all of a sudden, he BECOMES 'fast enough'. I'm thinking, whether he's top 3 year old (excluding RA) or not depends on whether or not he remains 'fast enough'.

Get my drift?

So, in other words, you think based on his accomplishments prior to May 2nd, he should have been considered in " this discussion " back in April? That's interesting and I would love you to explain this ( or even direct me to your posts about this from a few weeks, or more, ago ). And, let me offer a belated congratulations on the score you made in the KY Derby and further compliment you on your modesty, until now, about this life altering event.

gales0678 · #13 05-19-2009, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Especially if that were Quality Road and the horse beat Mind that Bird head to head in at least one of those races.

scott - what if they go back to Sunland for the summer after winning the belmont and don't go head to head vs QR

I'll give QR 3 wins in NY , but, i won't give him the classic on the poly in california - who would get the vote , who won the more important races

injuries are part of the game it's unfortunate that QR did not get to compete in the TC , but how in the world could you in all honesty vote for QR over MTB in this secnario - explain please

2 Dollar Bill · #14 05-19-2009, 09:58 AM

Its only May 19th........ Right ???

SniperSB23 · #15 05-19-2009, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

scott - what if they go back to Sunland for the summer after winning the belmont and don't go head to head vs QR

I'll give QR 3 wins in NY , but, i won't give him the classic on the poly in california - who would get the vote , who won the more important races

injuries are part of the game it's unfortunate that QR did not get to compete in the TC , but how in the world could you in all honesty vote for QR over MTB in this secnario - explain please

It would be an interesting vote if that happened. I think there would be a huge backlash against the owners for ducking the competition by hiding out in New Mexico. I also think the stupidity of hiding a gelding cause you might lose the prestige of an Eclipse Award when he could be out earning checks is a pretty amusing scenario.

Kasept · #16 05-19-2009, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

This is a very interesting case with this horse. He WASN't 'fast enough' to even be considered in the discussion a few weeks ago. Then, as luck would have it, he gets cut off out of the gate and the jock decides to ride him off the pace. And, all of a sudden, he BECOMES 'fast enough'. I'm thinking, whether he's top 3 year old (excluding RA) or not depends on whether or not he remains 'fast enough'.

TFM,

The decision was made well before the race that Mine That Bird was going to be taken back and come with one run. As soon as they saw that they could get into the Derby with their earnings, Woolley sought out Jerry Hissam, Borel's agent, and told him what they were looking to do and that they wanted Borel specifically. While the break exacerbated the 'take back/one run' scenario, it wasn't happenstance that the gelding was coming from well off the pace in the Derby.

cmorioles · #17 05-19-2009, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

Not counting the fillies if the vote was held today Mind That Bird would be my vote.

If he wins the Belmont , i don't see how that wouldn't lock up the title after that race - 2 wins and a second in the TC would have to make him a lock for 3 yr old colt of the year no?

For the love of God....it is M-I-N-E That Bird! Why can't people get a simple name like this right?

gales0678 · #18 05-19-2009, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmorioles

For the love of God....it is M-I-N-E That Bird! Why can't people get a simple name like this right?

it has been edited

cmorioles · #19 05-19-2009, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gales0678

it has been edited

Now that it has been fixed, I can respond. No way does a Belmont win lock up 3 year old of the year. He has not won another race all year, and might have to do more if some other horse goes on a hot streak later. He certainly has a leg up on the competition.

gales0678 · #20 05-19-2009, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

It would be an interesting vote if that happened. I think there would be a huge backlash against the owners for ducking the competition by hiding out in New Mexico. I also think the stupidity of hiding a gelding cause you might lose the prestige of an Eclipse Award when he could be out earning checks is a pretty amusing scenario.

what if the connections take him up to Woodbine to run in some of the big races up there and he wins - does that get held against him as well

it's a long way to go - my main point is IF he wins the belmont , another 3yr old colt would have to run the table in some pretty big races including the BCC out on the poly in cali - and i don't think Jimmy will go to california with QR in my opinion to run on the cushion , so if MTB wins at BEL i don't see a chance for QR to overtake him for 3 yr old of the year because i don't think QR is going to Califronia no matter how many races in NY he wins