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#1
08-14-2006, 02:31 PM
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So just WHO targets and kills civilians??
Those of you who think Hezbollah just showed up 6 weeks ago are knowingly wrong. They've been a part (sometimes a bad part) of the landscape in the Middle East for a long time. And it's very much debatable which side took the first "go to war" actions.
For all of you generalizing Israeli casualties as the Arab targeting of civilians, here is a count of the dead: Israel Civilians 39 Soldiers 109 Total 148 Lebanon Civilians 689 Fighters 102 Total 791 Interesting numbers. For those wondering what the Israeli military thinks of the deal their politicians made, here's what Lt. Roy Shaposik of the Israeli Army had to say, "We didn't get anything out of this. I think this is the first time that Israel lost a war." Just another way to view things other than the ultra pro-Israel/ Anti-Arab way of rationalization. 
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#2
08-14-2006, 03:24 PM
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B....now I am as white bread american as they come. Hitler would have taken one look at me and told me to go make tons of babies. Hitler was one evil SOB and in no way do I believe in anything he wanted, but merely providing you with a background as to my heritage....Im about as WASPy as they come....so I have no dog in this fight over there. But, if it is true that Hezbollah is hiding, living and fighting among the civilians, isn't it true to expect the civilian casualty count to be higher? I mentioned on here a couple weeks ago that I was furtunate enough to sit down privately with a Colonel in the Israeli military and get that side of the whole ordeal. I know of no one that is able to sit me down and explain to me the other side. I am not passing judgement by anymeans, only trying to better understand the whole war going on from both sides.
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#3
08-14-2006, 06:43 PM
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hezbollah sets up their rocket launchers in the middle of their civvies....on purpose. why? to make the 'evil israelis' appear even more so...why, the monsters. look at all the innocent people killed!
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#4
08-14-2006, 07:47 PM
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If you've read Seymore Hirsh's article in the New Yorker, you might get an insight as to what is really happening.
Bush gave Condi the instructions to stall...so Israel could go ahead and "defeat the terrorists". Guess what? They didn't. Hezbollah is now claiming "victory" that they held off a surperior military force (third largest in the world). Are the terrorists gaining confidence? Unfortunately, this mess is just a pretext to divert attention from the US failure in Iraq prior to the November elections, where the Republicans will loose their majority in the House of Representatives. The "War on Terror" has been the "play card". Feed the fear. Reality is that the British were pushed to make arrests for the 9-11 type terror attacks, and people have lined up to take off their shoes, discard their toothpaste and lipstick...all to make the world more "secure". HMMM. Reminds me of an "orange alert" two summers ago when the tunnels going into NYC were under threat, and I sat for hours in the heat on the NJ Turnpike. Does this little boy "cry wolf" enough? Seems that lots play along with the nonsense...even vote for it. Now, the REAL future... The US (Bush and neo cons) will use any and all pretexts for dropping 500K bombs (bunker busters) on already targeted Iranian sites....YES! IRAN! Unfortunately, this action will not be won either. The US military does not have sufficient man power to put "boots on the ground". Already many troops are doing second and third tours in Iraq...trying to deny the reality of the "civil war" that was created by Bush's and his "policy advisors'" actions. Two things to consider... 1) Disapproval of current policies by this administration, especially regarding Iraq are at an all time low...28% in favor. 2) Israeli actions against Lebanon, though unsupported by the vast majority of the world's nations, are only a pretext to future actions that will generate even more animosity in the Arab world. Seems that Hitler taught the Jewish people a great deal. Instead of learning from that lesson, the apply those lessons to others... and it will indeed cost us all, just like the misguided policies of the Bush administration. Last edited by Downthestretch55 : 08-14-2006 at 07:56 PM.
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#5
08-14-2006, 07:49 PM
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This is pure spin....
1) where do these figures come from 2) the terrorists hide among the innocent 3) when you bite the big dog.... 1) Lebanon has made outrageous claims of civilian casualties from the beginning, they have been exposed inflating civilian casualty numbers several times...the Israeli's can't provide accurate numbers regarding the Lebanese and there is no independent group there to my knowledge so I'd have to know exactly who is providing the numbers here! 2) As others have stated, the terrorists hid among civilian populations for the purpose of driving up these numbers. 3) Israel simply has more firepower...if the terrorists had the Israeli airforce, Israel would be carpet bombed and you know it!
__________________
"Always be yourself...unless you suck!" Last edited by somerfrost : 08-14-2006 at 07:52 PM.
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#6
08-14-2006, 07:59 PM
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...the answer to the actual question is terrorists.
So just WHO targets and kills civilians??
Terrorists.
__________________
"You miss 100% of the shots that you don't take." Follow me with the Rays grounds crew at https://twitter.com/TripleCrown59 www.facebook.com/TripleCrown59 K&S pics- http://share.shutterfly.com/action/w...0BYtWrhw2csXLA
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#7
08-14-2006, 08:03 PM
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That is simply a bunch of crap, the most outlandish stuff I've read thus far...comparing Israel to Nazi Germany...man, the true colors are starting to show now! A nation defends itself against terrorist attack and the "Hate America" crowd turns the entire thing into a Jew-Bush conspiracy! This post doesn't deserve a response except for the fact that some crackpots will actually buy it (obviously, it's posted here). What about the concerns of a prominent historian who states that August 22nd is a special day for the radical Islamics, the day a great Islamic warrior defeated his foes and stood victorious on the banks of Palestine and something else I didn't get about Mohammad...according to this guy, the crackpots in Iran have orchestrated this mess to draw world attention away from their nuke program and their fearless leader, you know..the guy who wants Israel destroyed and says the Holocaust never happened, is planning on answering the world regarding the nuke program on...August 22nd! His answer...nuking Israel and if possible us! That theory is as credible as this crap!!!!!
__________________
"Always be yourself...unless you suck!"
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#8
08-14-2006, 08:07 PM
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Please take the time to read Seymore Hersh's article. Pay careful attention to his last sentence. http://www.newyorker.com/fact/conten.../060821fa_fact
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#9
08-14-2006, 08:35 PM
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like that last sentence is so profound. you can find it on posters in many breakrooms of companies, HR people seem to like it.
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#10
08-14-2006, 08:40 PM
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Somerfrost,
I just reread what you judged me to be...a part of the "hate America crowd". Shame! Shame! Shame on you! Do you really believe that? If you do...there is no hope for your judgement of me. I HAVE NOT judged you or the opinions you voice. So, to clarify, for the hundredth time... I LOVE America! If I didn't, I wouldn't express my opposition to the insane policies that are bringing ruin to it. To simplify...one can love America without supporting those that currently lead it down a road to disaster. I can love the USA without loving the current administration. There's a very big difference. Your arguement and judgement reminds me quite a bit of Spiro Agnew, when he expressed disdain for those that spoke the truth regarding Viet Nam. We both should remember how that turned out...and how Spiro did also. I love America! DTS
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#11
08-14-2006, 08:47 PM
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Do you mean "human resources"? Explain, as you seem either to be writing in code or are lazy with your typing.
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#12
08-14-2006, 08:54 PM
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yeah, human resources.
but i have to say dts, i can't believe you're comparing israels actions to hitler and germany, when they killed millions in death camps. that disturbs me. and yeah, i'm feeling lazy tonite, another 12 hour day with me getting up before 3 am. but i get to sleep in tomorrow, til 4. yay
__________________
Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#13
08-14-2006, 09:11 PM
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If my words disturb you, I apologize. I was raised to "turn the other cheek", "give my cloak also". Passing on injustices only perpetuates hatred. Matt: 23: 28-29... "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like white washed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones, and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness."
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#14
08-14-2006, 11:09 PM
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__________________
"Always be yourself...unless you suck!"
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#15
08-15-2006, 12:26 AM
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I really debated with myself whether to post on this thread! DTS: What happened to the Jews can't be contained in one sentence! They haven't passed on the injustices of Hitler(that is outlandish) Since their statehood in 1948, the Israelis' have been in the forefront of the gathering storm bent on their destruction, with nary a moments peace. America came to their aid for many reasons, and America will rightly support them in these dark times! The thing that is apparent is your dizzying perception of All things Bush. the Scripture quote was aimed at the administration. You presume to know their souls,now?? That was a weak and errant slam! Also, I noticed that the article had such pin-point and irrefutable sources bursting out all over the pages. You really should at least start in the 'middle' before you swerve so viciously to the LEFT! Somer: you have issue with the Bible because of its' repudiation of Witchcraft in all forms! In previous posts you described yourself as somewhere between Christian and Wiccan....Well..the Wiccan thing hasen't been working out too good for you recently! Still time to get it right,my friend! If either of you Gents want to continue..it might be best to PM
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#16
08-15-2006, 12:40 AM
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Quote:
__________________
"Always be yourself...unless you suck!"
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#17
08-15-2006, 12:54 AM
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Somer: As I stated ..it would have been prudent to PM, instead of this forum. Firstly: I apologize if I offended you for what I said...but you don't get to cut out the parts of the BOOK because it interferes with your interpretation of life. And, believe me,Somer....what I stated wasn't said with reference to this time in your life! I enjoy you, especially since you give DTS what for(that flamer) It would be good to continue, but I'm not gonna do an ESPN thing over here. So...Pm me and we'll play Spiritual chess if you wish...Peace
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#18
08-15-2006, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
__________________
"Always be yourself...unless you suck!"
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#19
08-15-2006, 01:17 AM
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Off to bed with you then...take care! Later
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#20
08-15-2006, 10:49 AM
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2. you are wrong, again 3. you are correct 4. of course the U.S. was aboard. but you're wrong about any assault on Iran. The U.S. does not have the capacity and the Israelis had trouble getting food, water and field goggles to their troops 5 miles away. 5. there is hope for a backlash, yes. we can hope. but you can forget about your dream of riding on top of a nuke into tehran. it'snot gonna happen. 6. The Syrians are the "gamechanger" in all this. You should know that much by now. 7. Victory is in the eye of the beholder, I assume. All I know is the "blamestorming" is just getting started in TelAviv. 8. There is NO "heavy" fighting going on as you wrote. 9. Here's what is going on in Gaza: http://www.theconservativevoice.com/article/16946.html
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