Put a fork in the Red Sox

[the_fat_man]

Done.

Cooked.

It's all over for this year.

Way to put a team together.

Where do I get one of these jobs where I'm INEPT yet still make tons of money?

[Nascar1966]

Im going to quit picking them in my contests that I play. I have been burned by them too many times already this year. Bad thing is this still is the first month of baseball season.

[dalakhani]

I don't disagree that the Sox are in trouble. There is a giant hole in the middle of that lineup and Papi looks like he is seriously missing the needle. Maybe they are biding their time and hoping to get Gonzalez on the cheap.

Either way, how does one call a GM that has won two world series...the only two in the last 90 years in boston...inept? Theo is a lot of things but inept is not one of them.

[MaTH716]

They have too much pitching to stick a fork in them already.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

They have too much pitching to stick a fork in them already.

Exactly. Lester is going to work his way out of this. Beckett will be fine. Bucholz is right there. They can work out the bottom of the rotation from there.

That being said, to compete in the AL East, you need power. Were they really banking on Beltre and Cameron to deliver it? I think there will be moves coming. The Sox would sooner be average for a year than to break from their plans and grossly overpay at this point.

[hi_im_god]

i usually make one baseball post/year. because i f'in hate baseball. it's early but here it is:

"oooooh! they won 8 in a row! we're going to win the world series!"

"aaaaah! they lost 8 in a row! we're never going to win another game!"

"huh. will you look at that. they finished .500."

-baseball fan unable to deal with statistically insignificant fluctuations.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Exactly. Lester is going to work his way out of this. Beckett will be fine. Bucholz is right there. They can work out the bottom of the rotation from there.

That being said, to compete in the AL East, you need power. Were they really banking on Beltre and Cameron to deliver it? I think there will be moves coming. The Sox would sooner be average for a year than to break from their plans and grossly overpay at this point.

The yankees have 16 HR's, the Red Sox have 14.

After 12 games is is readily apparent that it is far to early to assume anything. I believe that their offense would be fine...if they stopped giving up so many runs!!! That is their biggest issue. Adding offense is far easier than adding pitching.

Beltre avged 25 HR's from 2006-08 in Seattle
He was famously injured for much of last year
Why wouldnt they expect 20+ HR's from him?
Cameron was signed as a defensive CF. His last 4 year HR totals?
22,21,25,24

Why exactly should they expect less than that? There are 150 games left...

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The yankees have 16 HR's, the Red Sox have 14.

After 12 games is is readily apparent that it is far to early to assume anything. I believe that their offense would be fine...if they stopped giving up so many runs!!! That is their biggest issue. Adding offense is far easier than adding pitching.

Beltre avged 25 HR's from 2006-08 in Seattle
He was famously injured for much of last year
Why wouldnt they expect 20+ HR's from him?
Cameron was signed as a defensive CF. His last 4 year HR totals?
22,21,25,24

Why exactly should they expect less than that? There are 150 games left...

yeah but there is no one in that lineup that you have to fear and in that park that isnt good. You have an outfield that consists of JD Drew (35) Mike Cameron (37) and Jacoby Elsbury. Cameron strikes out way too much. Drew is too inconsistent and doesnt have that much power at this stage in his career (11,19,24 hrs last three years in that park). Elsbury is a nice player but hardly a slugger. So you have no power in the outfield.

My prediction is that none of these players will crack 30 hrs...in Fenway of all places. That isnt going to work.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

yeah but there is no one in that lineup that you have to fear and in that park that isnt good. You have an outfield that consists of JD Drew (35) Mike Cameron (37) and Jacoby Elsbury. Cameron strikes out way too much. Drew is too inconsistent and doesnt have that much power at this stage in his career (11,19,24 hrs last three years in that park). Elsbury is a nice player but hardly a slugger. So you have no power in the outfield.

My prediction is that none of these players will crack 30 hrs...in Fenway of all places. That isnt going to work.

What you are saying has no bearing on winning or losing games. Fear? C'mon who is feared? Pujols maybe? Where were they finding "feared" guys?

Drew has been terrible but he has a untradable contract and they are going to have to deal with him for another year regardless. Cameron is a placeholder with power as is Beltre. Beltre is signed to a 1 year deal and Cameron a 2 year deal. They have three 4 star or better OF prospects (though one had brain surgery recently an will be out for awhile).

They made a commitment to pitchers Lackey and Beckett and signed 2 defensive players with acceptable power to short term contracts. Over the course of 162 games things even out. Victor martinez is hitting something like .215. Youkilis is hitting .235. Lester has an era of 8.44.

As for the Red Sox needing 30 HR guys in the OF?? In 2007 when they won the WS and 96 games the starting OF's had 37 HR's.....combined.

[Danzig]

didn't the yanks start slow last year? seems like there were some comments very early on that they weren't doing too well.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

didn't the yanks start slow last year? seems like there were some comments very early on that they weren't doing too well.

They were 12-10 in April last year.

They have played less than 10% of the schedule...

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

What you are saying has no bearing on winning or losing games. Fear? C'mon who is feared? Pujols maybe? Where were they finding "feared" guys?

Drew has been terrible but he has a untradable contract and they are going to have to deal with him for another year regardless. Cameron is a placeholder with power as is Beltre. Beltre is signed to a 1 year deal and Cameron a 2 year deal. They have three 4 star or better OF prospects (though one had brain surgery recently an will be out for awhile).

They made a commitment to pitchers Lackey and Beckett and signed 2 defensive players with acceptable power to short term contracts. Over the course of 162 games things even out. Victor martinez is hitting something like .215. Youkilis is hitting .235. Lester has an era of 8.44.

As for the Red Sox needing 30 HR guys in the OF?? In 2007 when they won the WS and 96 games the starting OF's had 37 HR's.....combined.

I definitely haven't "put a fork in them" but regardless, in my opinion, they need another bat in the lineup. No team has won the world series without a 30 hr hitter in the lineup since the '99 yankees and i don't think you would confuse this red sox team with them.

We will see. I figured that they would have issues at the plate before the season started and it looks like thats true.

[Bigsmc]

I don't think they are done, but the one thing I took away from that series is the Sox defense was brutal. They committed 5 errors in 4 games, but there were three or four more questionable rulings that could have put them up to a 2 error a game aveerage.

They botched fly balls, they botched caroms off the outfield wall and Betre actually lost a ground ball in the lights. They can not make the playoffs playing defense like that. It was only a four game sample, but they have to stop giving away free runs.

[horseofcourse]

It won't last...but there really is nothing on the planet much more enjoyable than seeing Boston teams lose a lot.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Bigsmc

I don't think they are done, but the one thing I took away from that series is the Sox defense was brutal. They committed 5 errors in 4 games, but there were three or four more questionable rulings that could have put them up to a 2 error a game aveerage.

They botched fly balls, they botched caroms off the outfield wall and Betre actually lost a ground ball in the lights. They can not make the playoffs playing defense like that. It was only a four game sample, but they have to stop giving away free runs.

Seems to me like that's the kind of ballpark that would take more than two weeks to get used to playing in, and they have a lot of new additions. I'd love to see the Red Sox suck this year, but it's ridiculously early to be panicking.

[gales0678]

boston relies on being a 53 + win team at home every year

they have been a very average team on the road the last 5-6 years for a team that wins 90 games a year

if they play .500 ball on the road , which is about what they have averaged over the last 6 yrs they are going to need to win 54 out of their next 74 in Fenway park to get to 95 wins , starting 1-6 at home is a disaster for them

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by gales0678

boston relies on being a 53 + win team at home every year

they have been a very average team on the road the last 5-6 years for a team that wins 90 games a year

if they play .500 ball on the road , which is about what they have averaged over the last 6 yrs they are going to need to win 54 out of their next 74 in Fenway park to get to 95 wins , starting 1-6 at home is a disaster for them

Prior year wins have nothing to do with this year

[Gaelic Storm]

Ellsbury has been out and the pitching has been bad. 3 of their 4 series they played were against arguably 3 of the top 5 teams in baseball. The Red Sox are the best run org in baseball over the past 7 or 8 years and are not done yet.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Prior year wins have nothing to do with this year

true chuck , but, the last few years fenway park has carried them into the playoffs , call it home cooking or not , but i don't see how they make the playoffs unless they win 52-55 home games

they don't win on the road at any great %

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by gales0678

true chuck , but, the last few years fenway park has carried them into the playoffs , call it home cooking or not , but i don't see how they make the playoffs unless they win 52-55 home games

they don't win on the road at any great %

They currently arent winning anywhere...but there are 149 games left.

And the notion that the Red Sox or any team gets "homecooking" is ridiclous