New York's forced carryover rule

[Calzone Lord]

The 2-4-1 Pick 3 starting in race #4 paid $191.00

The 2-4-1-ALL-ALL-ALL Pick 6 starting in race #4 paid $69.50


Basically, each winner today had $121.50 stolen from their pocket to fund a carryover for tomorrow.

Forcing a carryover is a mind-boggling horrid rule -- and it's happened twice in about two months now.

[gamblin4ever]

I can understand, Wed. night's card @ Woodbine cancelled after R4 due to lightning, my $54 pick 4 wager paid me back $26. Rule is no refund after 1st leg is official. I won't be wasting my money on multirace tickets anymore @ Woodbine, if I decide to even wager on that track again.

I don't understand why these tracks can't do the right thing and refund the wagers back.

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

The 2-4-1 Pick 3 starting in race #4 paid $191.00

The 2-4-1-ALL-ALL-ALL Pick 6 starting in race #4 paid $69.50


Basically, each winner today had $121.50 stolen from their pocket to fund a carryover for tomorrow.

Forcing a carryover is a mind-boggling horrid rule -- and it's happened twice in about two months now.

I'm not a Pick-6 player, but why don't they just pay the whole thing out. I can see paying the remainder of the Pick-6 by doing an all-all-etc, but basically by having a carryover seems a bit unfair to people who invest a load of money in the pool.

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

I'm not a Pick-6 player, but why don't they just pay the whole thing out. I can see paying the remainder of the Pick-6 by doing an all-all-etc, but basically by having a carryover seems a bit unfair to people who invest a load of money in the pool.

I assume they are scared this might happen on a double carryover day or something.

Instead of a forced carryover -- the rule -- if written fairly -- would be that the days pool is paid out at the standard takeout rate.

That way -- if this happens on a double carryover day -- the double carryover holds for the next day.

That would be a track friendly rule and not a player friendly rule ... but at least it's fair.

Nothing about the current rule is even slightly or remotely fair... and again .. I say this as someone who wasn't involved and didn't get screwed either time.

[Calzone Lord]

Steve Crist's take:

3:50 pm: Hold all non-existent tickets! The 7th, 8th and 9th were just taken off the turf and under INSANE New York state racing rules, this means that there is an automatic carryover. This rule totally screws people who remembered to put their tickets in, as only consos will be paid out and 75 percent of the new money, plus yesterday's carryover, carries until tomorrow.



4:00 pm: Yet more scratches are coming in fast and furious and Durkin is trying to explain the bizarro-world rules under which there's an automatic carryover; the pick-4 today pays for 1/All/All/All and the pick-6 pays out like a pick-5 on a 2/4/1/All/All/All even if you have 6 of 6. Everyone clear?

This happened last month at Belmont, and everyone said at the time that the rule about the automatic carryover was some kind of a mistake and would be changed, but here we are a month later and it's still in effect.

Think it's time to call it a day and start looking at tomorrow when I think there's a double carryover of [($58k from yesterday) + (75%x74%x$240k from today)], which would be just under $200k.



4:20 pm: But good news for Grand Slam players: Unlike the pick-4 and pick-6, instead of alls and carryovers, there's a simple refund of all Grand Slam bets.



4:47 pm: They just posted the pick-4 willpays -- and you did better than the win payoff! Gunman paid $10.60 to win and the payoff for a 1/All/All/All pick-4 is....$10.80!

As for the pick-6, the "willpays" say it's paying $69.50. So my Senior Moment saved me $480: I would have "had" the pick-6 12 times (2x3x2 in the all races) for a return of $840 on the $1,320 investment.

And the double-carryover into tomorrow is $192,141.

[jms62]

And the P3 rules totally screw me as i had a 1x3x4 ticket , hit the first leg was expecting to get it 12 times after the races came off only to get scratched down to 2 in the last leg and walk away empty handed. They cant even be consistent with their rules.