Moss calls him the best WR ever at Super Bowl press confrence

[Calzone Lord]

If people can think that Seattle Slew was a better race horse than Spectacular Bid ... obviously Jerry Rice doesn't deserve to be compared with Moss if that's the case.

Rice had that Spectacular Bid like level on unbelievably sustained elite production ... but anyone who actually watched Moss in college and early in Minny knows there will never be anything like him ever again.

[Calzone Lord]

The greatest football play I've ever seen a player make is at 7 minutes and 43 seconds into this video clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0oGFz48foA

He catches a Hail Mary, and manages a no-look behind the back lateral for a TD as time ran-out in the 1st half. The Vikes won the game by 8 points to go 6-0.

Interestingly, the box score credited Moe Williams with a 15-yard TD reception on that play. http://www.pro-football-reference.co...0310190min.htm


That Minny team in 2003 was really bad outside of Moss being at the tail end of his prime.

They had the 23rd ranked defense, and the leading rusher was Moe Williams and the 2nd leading receiver was Moe Williams.

Moe Williams 2nd best rushing season ever was 414 yards...and his 2nd best receiving season ever was 251 yards. And he was that teams leading rusher, 2nd leader in receiving yards behind Moss, and the defense was 23rd ranked in both points allowed and yards allowed.

Below AVG defense, plus Moe Williams as your 2nd best offense weapon, should never translate to a 6-0 start and a winning record.

Maybe that is why Nick Saben took Duante Culpepper over Drew Brees.

[Rudeboyelvis]

A classless Jerry Rice responds:

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8895051

Man, laugh it off if you are truly the best.

Personally I've got him 3rd behind Moss, Monk, then Jerry Rice.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

A classless Jerry Rice responds:

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8895051

Man, laugh it off if you are truly the best.

Personally I've got him 3rd behind Moss, Monk, then Jerry Rice.

Moss is the goat. Hands down. Rice also said that he put Young and Montana in the HOF. A little 2 cocky. Most of Moss numbers are with Culpepper. Says it all IMO.

[Dahoss]

After the last comment, it's pretty safe to say Rice is the best ever. DB1985 is never right about anything. Nor does he ever pay off his debts. Quite a combo.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Montana made Jerry Rice great. And he is one of the greats, no doubt.

Moss made Culpepper look like the greatest QB of all time.

I don't believe it can even be debated that Jerry Rice isn't Jerry Rice if he has Dante Culpepper behind center instead of Joe Montana.


If you can only define greatness by stats, then you not only have to be one of the best, but you then also have to fall into a perfect scenario to make you great. Like Jerry Rice.

If you can define greatness based on sheer impact - Moss is greater than Rice. Period.

Rice was an outstanding WR who benefited from having an outstanding cast around him, which often led to single/blown coverages thus amazing plays and stats.

Moss would force defenses to scheme around him. Moss, in his prime, changed the game.

[Dahoss]

Michael Irvin also called Moss the greatest deep threat ever....but found it laughable to call him best ever. It is pretty laughable. Yes it helped Rice had Montana but it also helped Montana he had Rice.

Not really sure why its classless for Rice to say he's the best, but not for Moss to say he's the best. Double standard much?

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Michael Irvin also called Moss the greatest deep threat ever....but found it laughable to call him best ever. It is pretty laughable. Yes it helped Rice had Montana but it also helped Montana he had Rice.

Not really sure why its classless for Rice to say he's the best, but not for Moss to say he's the best. Double standard much?

He came across as pissed that someone would possibly question his crowned status as the greatest ever and referenced his 3 rings as that being his self-appointed benchmark for greatness. He did correctly reference the good fortune of playing with the greatest pair of QB's ever, which was a bit redeeming, but overall came across as classless. If you don't agree, then well, there's that. One opinion vs. another.

Like I said - if he wasn't so threatened by Moss, laugh it off and wish the guy luck. He would definitely have come across as the bigger man, at least.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

He came across as pissed that someone would possibly question his crowned status as the greatest ever and referenced his 3 rings as that being his self-appointed benchmark for greatness. He did correctly reference the good fortune of playing with the greatest pair of QB's ever, which was a bit redeeming, but overall came across as classless. If you don't agree, then well, there's that. One opinion vs. another.

Like I said - if he wasn't so threatened by Moss, laugh it off and wish the guy luck. He would definitely have come across as the bigger man, at least.

Do you think it was classless for Moss to say he was the best ever?

I don't think he's threatened at all, but we can assume these guys all have pretty big egos. When someone questions your rightful spot as the top dog, you respond.

He did wish Moss luck, after he explained why he thought he was the greatest. We'll agree to disagree, but I am interested in your response to whether or not you thought it was classless of Moss as well.

[Rudeboyelvis]

To answer you question first, Hoss - no I don't find it classless. I find it kinda humorous, and 100% correct. Perhaps if I held the popular opinion that Rice is the self appointed king of all WR's, it might rub me the wrong way. I guess.

Rice is one of the greats - there's no denying that. But in fairness the amazing fortune of being placed on one of the greatest offenses in NFL history for that dream career should weighted into the formulation.

In a lot of people's eye's, the stats he amassed make him the greatest. Fine.

Zennatta had a hand-picked, dream career too. Is she the greatest of all time? Ever try to argue against that point with a Zennatta fan?

The fervor seems eerily paralleled.

[Dahoss]

I guess I don't see how one guy can be classless for thinking (and then saying) he is the best ever and pointing to his accomplishments as proof, while retired. And then another can not be considered classless for thinking and saying the same thing, a week before the ultimate team game.

For me personally, what I saw Rice do on the field makes him the greatest. I couldn't even tell you what his stats are without looking them up. I also don't think most of the players who call Rice the best are looking at his stats. Moss is obviously in the discussion, no denying that. He's an amazing talent.

I get the argument that Rice was helped playing in a great offense. But I think it is important to remember that part of what made it so great was Rice.

Do we look at Jordan differently because he played with Pippen? Is Magic Johnson not as great because he played with countless hall of famers? Was Mickey Mantle not great because he played with so many hall of famers? I don't think so, so why should we hold it against Rice?

[NTamm1215]

Moss has had 6 of the greatest seasons of any wide receiver in the history of football. That does not make him the greatest wide receiver ever. He had an enormous impact on the game and his talent is unmatched. But, Rice is the greatest ever in my opinion.

Rice had 60+ catch season from Jeff Garcia and 1000+ yard seasons with Rich Gannon. He was remarkably consistent throughout his career, something Randy Moss has not been.

DrugS once compared Moss to Discreet Cat. A truly freakish talent that was unstoppable when on his game. But, he could not be counted on long term. It's a terrific comparison.

If I were Rice, I wouldn't have even dignified it with a response.

[Calzone Lord]

Precociousness was a big part of that comparison -- Discreet Cat ran a faster number in his debut than Lost in the Fog did while winning the King's Bishop on the same card. In terms of comparing careers ... Discreet Cat obviously isn't a 1st ballot Hall of Famer, Moss is.

A point that hasn't been touched upon -- Randy Moss was recently voted as the player who had the best rookie season in NFL history at ANY POSITION, not just WR. In other words, he is the most outstanding rookie in NFL history.

#1 rookie season of all-time clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkex_soikf0

Remember, you have to be in college 3 seasons before you're eligible to play in the NFL.

There are reputable scouts who say Randy Moss almost certainly would have been a high quality NFL starter when he was a junior in high school. All of his measurables were there at that age and he is regarded as the consensus best high school football player in history at any position by the most reputable old scouts alive today.

Moss went his entire college career without getting shut out a single time. That's impossible and will never happen again. Moss caught 54 TD's in his only two seasons at Marshall. Rice got just 9 TD's in his first two seasons at Mississippi Valley State.

Moss fell in the draft to late 1st round because he was arrested 3 times before he ever played a snap in the NFL. He severed a jail stint. And he had scholarships revoked at Notre Dame and FSU before ever playing a snap there. He also refused to go to the NFL combine in Indy because he had already made a dentist appointment to get braces that week.

If any player today had the rap sheet and blew the combine off for a dentist appt ... they simply wouldn't get drafted.

[Dahoss]

He was the consensus best HS player ever, beat up on Ball State and Kent State in college and blew off the combine to get braces?

Nevermind what Rice did on the field in the NFL. Moss is the best.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

A classless Jerry Rice responds:

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8895051

Man, laugh it off if you are truly the best.

Personally I've got him 3rd behind Moss, Monk, then Jerry Rice.

I don't know if Moss is better than Rice or if Rice is better than Moss but Art Monk doesn't make my top 20.
Hell he isnt even the best Redskin WR, Charley Taylor would have that honor.

[golfer]

Sure Rice had Montana, BUT Moss had Pennington in College, it's a wash!

[Calzone Lord]

Warren Sapp, Deion Sanders, Michael Irvin, and Brian Billick's take on this topic:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-networ...ace-in-history

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

He was the consensus best HS player ever, beat up on Ball State and Kent State in college and blew off the combine to get braces?

Nevermind what Rice did on the field in the NFL. Moss is the best.

Moss (like all players) was denied an opportunity to be allowed to play in the NFL in his prime because of the rule that players had to have 3 years of college.

Anyone who saw Moss in the years before he arrived in the NFL knew his prime was being wasted by college.

Terrell Owens did absolutely nothing in college until his senior year while he played for the Chattanooga Mocking Birds.

Jerry Rice didn't start turning it on in college until his Junior while playing in a very pass happy offense at Mississippi Valley State.

When Moss was at Marshall, he was recognized as the best player in all of college football at any position before his 2nd season.

The most reputable scouts awarded him that honor ... even Sports Illustrated called him the nations best player at any position going into his sophomore year.

The Moss who played at Marshall was a MUCH better athlete and had much greater leaping ability than the Moss who caught 23 TD's on that 16-0 Patriots team in 2007. He didn't play a single snap of pre-season that year and was coming off of a dud year in Oakland where he had hamstring issues.

Jerry Rice ran a 4.7 forty yard dash at the combine -- he didn't win with speed or size. Moss won with speed, size, body control, leaping ability, and incredible hands ... do you think he had more of those qualities at age 20 or age 30?

He had more speed at age 20, but he didn't have Brady throwing him the ball until he was 30. Brady got hurt in his 2nd season. So Moss was over 32 years old by the time he got his second season with Brady started.

From age 31 onward -- of course Rice is going to be a much better WR. His entire game wasn't based around his speed.

[Calzone Lord]

Here was an interesting quote about Moss from his rookie season:

“When I think of Randy Moss, I just think . . . Wow. Our second Super Bowl year in Denver was his first year in Minnesota back in 1997. We were set to play the Jets in the AFC Championship Game, but really, we were already thinking about having to face Randy in the Super Bowl. We were horrified of that dude. Horrified. We had Ray Crockett and Darrien Gordon as our cornerbacks. Randy was 6-foot-4. They were 5-7. And he was a hell of a lot faster than both of them. We all knew we had no chance at stopping him if we’d played him in the Super Bowl that year. None. We had the late game on that Championship Game weekend. Once they lost — somehow — to the Falcons, we knew we were winning the Super Bowl that year. We didn’t have to face Randy Moss. The rest was easy. That was that. He scared the hell out of us.“

— Trevor Pryce, Denver Broncos,

Eddie George...

“In 2002, we played him and the Vikings up in the Metrodome, and I’ll never forget this. He took a wide receiver screen — a 2-yard pass at the line of scrimmage — and he smoked the fastest player on our team, Samari Rolle, for a 60-yard touchdown. I’d never seen anything like it. He caught a screen pass, and then, on a dead sprint — just burned right past our fastest guy. “

— Eddie George, former NFL player

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Moss (like all players) was denied an opportunity to be allowed to play in the NFL in his prime because of the rule that players had to have 3 years of college.

Anyone who saw Moss in the years before he arrived in the NFL knew his prime was being wasted by college.

Terrell Owens did absolutely nothing in college until his senior year while he played for the Chattanooga Mocking Birds.

Jerry Rice didn't start turning it on in college until his Junior while playing in a very pass happy offense at Mississippi Valley State.

When Moss was at Marshall, he was recognized as the best player in all of college football at any position before his 2nd season.

The most reputable scouts awarded him that honor ... even Sports Illustrated called him the nations best player at any position going into his sophomore year.

The Moss who played at Marshall was a MUCH better athlete and had much greater leaping ability than the Moss who caught 23 TD's on that 16-0 Patriots team in 2007. He didn't play a single snap of pre-season that year and was coming off of a dud year in Oakland where he had hamstring issues.

Jerry Rice ran a 4.7 forty yard dash at the combine -- he didn't win with speed or size. Moss won with speed, size, body control, leaping ability, and incredible hands ... do you think he had more of those qualities at age 20 or age 30?

He had more speed at age 20, but he didn't have Brady throwing him the ball until he was 30. Brady got hurt in his 2nd season. So Moss was over 32 years old by the time he got his second season with Brady started.

From age 31 onward -- of course Rice is going to be a much better WR. His entire game wasn't based around his speed.

You've repeated most of this stuff like a dozen times man. Doesn't change my opinion. I don't care what Moss did at Marshall.

IMO, as an NFL receiver Rice is the best. Moss is top 3 or 4.