Derby Trail Forums

Go Back   Derby Trail Forums > Main Forum > The Paddock
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-07-2015, 07:51 AM
Kasept's Avatar
Kasept Kasept is online now
Steve Byk
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Greenwich, NY
Posts: 43,503
Default Cold/Wind KO's Aqueduct again Wednesday

No racing at the Big A. Miserable here with wind brutal.. Knocks out really good card.
__________________
All ambitions are lawful except those which climb upward on the miseries or credulities of mankind. ~ Joseph Conrad
A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right. ~ Thomas Paine
Don't let anyone tell you that your dreams can't come true. They are only afraid that theirs won't and yours will. ~ Robert Evans
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-07-2015, 09:18 AM
dellinger63's Avatar
dellinger63 dellinger63 is offline
Keeneland
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 10,072
Default

That's too bad. I thought there was a good chance Sciacca was going to break out of containment today.

But cheer up New Yorkers with the news it's minus 4 here with wind chills 30-40 below. Most all, including Chicago schools closed.
__________________
“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-07-2015, 09:26 AM
jms62's Avatar
jms62 jms62 is offline
Saratoga
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 19,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dellinger63 View Post
That's too bad. I thought there was a good chance Sciacca was going to break out of containment today.

But cheer up New Yorkers with the news it's minus 4 here with wind chills 30-40 below. Most all, including Chicago schools closed.
Because of the cold? We are raising a generation of Veal
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-07-2015, 09:49 AM
dellinger63's Avatar
dellinger63 dellinger63 is offline
Keeneland
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 10,072
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jms62 View Post
Because of the cold? We are raising a generation of Veal
Won't matter anyway as according to climate experts we passed the line of no return for a Global Warming ending.

Anytime now we'll be underwater, only not today as we'd be under ice.
__________________
“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-07-2015, 10:47 AM
freddymo freddymo is offline
Belmont Park
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 7,091
Default

Assuming tomorrow will be SCUTTLED as well
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-07-2015, 12:05 PM
ateamstupid's Avatar
ateamstupid ateamstupid is offline
Super Mod.. and Super Fly
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 13,036
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddymo View Post
Assuming tomorrow will be SCUTTLED as well
I doubt it. It'll be cold but not nearly as windy, plus Friday/Saturday weather is iffy so I think they'll try their best to get tomorrow's card in.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-07-2015, 03:59 PM
blackthroatedwind blackthroatedwind is offline
Jerome Park
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 9,936
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cardus View Post
I am nearby Aqueduct and it is ridiculously windy.
Hitting that one out of the park would be too easy.
__________________
Just more nebulous nonsense from BBB
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-08-2015, 08:03 AM
TouchOfGrey's Avatar
TouchOfGrey TouchOfGrey is offline
Hollywood Park
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Floral Park, NY
Posts: 921
Default

Thursday canceled too.
__________________
"An Absolute Thriller!!" - Grassy wins a six-way photo finish, Saratoga 9th, 8-22-09
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-08-2015, 08:37 AM
freddymo freddymo is offline
Belmont Park
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 7,091
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchOfGrey View Post
Thursday canceled too.
Please stick with the proper DT vernacular.... SCUTTLED. Actually I maybe be incorrect perhaps canceled is consistent with the day being scrapped and scuttled is for turf racing switched to main. Either way gets the point across.lol
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-09-2015, 01:24 PM
ateamstupid's Avatar
ateamstupid ateamstupid is offline
Super Mod.. and Super Fly
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 13,036
Default

Canceled two races in today after Italian Rules and Apex both break down in the 2nd. Brutal.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-09-2015, 01:34 PM
Pants II's Avatar
Pants II Pants II is offline
Arlington Park
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 4,458
Default

I feel bad for David Jacobson. Where else is he gonna get free money today?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-10-2015, 08:59 AM
herkhorse's Avatar
herkhorse herkhorse is offline
Flemington
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Gonesville
Posts: 11,422
Default

scuttled again today
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-10-2015, 09:21 AM
geeker2's Avatar
geeker2 geeker2 is offline
Hialeah Park
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 6,235
Default

Jan. 9, 2015



STATEMENT FROM NYTHA PRESIDENT RICK VIOLETTE JR. ON THE INCREASE OF EQUINE FATALITIES AT AQUEDUCT RACETRACK:

“The horsemen are obviously deeply concerned about the significant increase in equine fatalities at Aqueduct this winter. Tomorrow morning, a group of trainers, including myself and NYTHA Board members Linda Rice and Rick Schosberg, will meet with a NYRA management team including Senior Vice President of Racing Operations Martin Panza, Vice President of Facilities and Racing Surfaces Glen Kozak and Chief Examing Veterinarian Dr. Anthony Verderosa. There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate.”
__________________
We've Gone Delirious
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-10-2015, 10:55 AM
ScottJ ScottJ is offline
Narragansett Park
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 585
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by geeker2 View Post
Jan. 9, 2015
h
STATEMENT FROM NYTHA PRESIDENT RICK VIOLETTE JR. ON THE INCREASE OF EQUINE FATALITIES AT AQUEDUCT RACETRACK:

“The horsemen are obviously deeply concerned about the significant increase in equine fatalities at Aqueduct this winter. Tomorrow morning, a group of trainers, including myself and NYTHA Board members Linda Rice and Rick Schosberg, will meet with a NYRA management team including Senior Vice President of Racing Operations Martin Panza, Vice President of Facilities and Racing Surfaces Glen Kozak and Chief Examing Veterinarian Dr. Anthony Verderosa. There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate.”
The NYRA should discontinue racing between the first weekend of December and the first weekend of April. Return the racing calendar to years back when the circuit consisted of eight months of racing.

This would :

[1] eliminate the Aqueduct Inner Track debate all together,
[2] eliminate the need for lower level horses racing on the circuit leading to the higher breakdown rates,
[3] increase the horse population available to second tier circuits, and
[4] allow NYRA to save money from what has largely been quoted as a money losing part of the season.

It becomes increasingly tiresome reading that the horsemen believe that the problem is always in the surface. While it is positive that all parties are talking (which could be viewed as the end-goal of the entire meeting), re-evaluating the need for winter racing should be the first order of business.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-10-2015, 11:09 AM
ScottJ ScottJ is offline
Narragansett Park
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 585
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ateamstupid View Post
Canceled two races in today after Italian Rules and Apex both break down in the 2nd. Brutal.
Does everyone remember when Bob Baffert was dragged through the media based on his California break-down rates? No one came to his defense as he was a big gun in the industry.

While allowing the trainers to challenge the racing surface, aren't the prerace protocols involved in preparing a horse the ultimate responsibility of the trainer? I would argue that they are.

If that were the case, why does NYRA and the audience not hear from Steve Klesaris and Naipaul Chatterpaul as to what was wrong with their horses prior to saddling them leading to their breakdowns? Having public trainer statements on why their horses are not returning from the track would be a first step in placing responsibility where it belongs.

Every winter, we seem to get involved in this same debate onto which the media (and organizations like PETA) latches come the spring season. Eventually, the inputs need to change in order to change the outcomes.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-10-2015, 11:42 AM
Kasept's Avatar
Kasept Kasept is online now
Steve Byk
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Greenwich, NY
Posts: 43,503
Default

Why don't you pull yourself up and stop with the blather? I don't have time to go point by point through the hysterical, scattershot suggestions/recriminations, but the right answer to scenarios like this are horses go wrong for countless reasons and instantaneous conclusions/demands/calls to action are utterly pointless and 100% useless.

Extended periods of racing without incident and spikes in breakdowns happen. The long term oversight put in place by NYRA after the Injury Task Force considered the 2012 incident spate have been recognized as very effective. If you want to stop breakdowns, end the sport. Otherwise, be prepared for these Edvard Munch moments of feigned outrage and horror to continue.
__________________
All ambitions are lawful except those which climb upward on the miseries or credulities of mankind. ~ Joseph Conrad
A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right. ~ Thomas Paine
Don't let anyone tell you that your dreams can't come true. They are only afraid that theirs won't and yours will. ~ Robert Evans
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-10-2015, 11:44 AM
Kasept's Avatar
Kasept Kasept is online now
Steve Byk
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Greenwich, NY
Posts: 43,503
Default

Here's the Task Force Report from 2012 if truly interested in understanding all the working parts of circumstances involving safety cautions: http://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/gov...nts/Report.pdf
__________________
All ambitions are lawful except those which climb upward on the miseries or credulities of mankind. ~ Joseph Conrad
A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right. ~ Thomas Paine
Don't let anyone tell you that your dreams can't come true. They are only afraid that theirs won't and yours will. ~ Robert Evans
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-10-2015, 11:51 AM
OTM Al's Avatar
OTM Al OTM Al is offline
Turf Paradise
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 225
Default

Hasn't Durso tweeted the same thing each day this week?

@JohnDursoJr: Due to severe cold, high winds & out of abundance of caution for safety of jockeys/horses, @TheNYRA has cancelled racing at Aqueduct today.

Except it isn't severly cold or windy today. Makes you wonder if he is even here.
__________________
facilis descensus Auerno
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-10-2015, 12:48 PM
ScottJ ScottJ is offline
Narragansett Park
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 585
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept View Post
Why don't you pull yourself up and stop with the blather? I don't have time to go point by point through the hysterical, scattershot suggestions/recriminations, but the right answer to scenarios like this are horses go wrong for countless reasons and instantaneous conclusions/demands/calls to action are utterly pointless and 100% useless.
Steve, we have spoken several times over the air and disappointed that you would refer to the discussion as blather. In fact, I was responding to the press release issued by Rick Violette, Jr.

My suggestion was to have public statements from trainers offering an explanation to the public as to what happened on the track. That does not feel utterly pointless, reactionary, or hysterical to me. All too often, the track and surface are cited as the core issue as opposed to looking at overall horse health as the first issue which is of course a more difficult issue and leads to accountability which is ultimately what we want in the game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kasept View Post
Extended periods of racing without incident and spikes in breakdowns happen. The long term oversight put in place by NYRA after the Injury Task Force considered the 2012 incident spate have been recognized as very effective. If you want to stop breakdowns, end the sport. Otherwise, be prepared for these Edvard Munch moments of feigned outrage and horror to continue.
I agree completely with your points here which is why the call for immediate press-release meetings between the horsemen's group and the NYRA management team seems hollow.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-10-2015, 01:50 PM
Kasept's Avatar
Kasept Kasept is online now
Steve Byk
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Greenwich, NY
Posts: 43,503
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
Steve, we have spoken several times over the air and disappointed that you would refer to the discussion as blather. In fact, I was responding to the press release issued by Rick Violette, Jr.

My suggestion was to have public statements from trainers offering an explanation to the public as to what happened on the track. That does not feel utterly pointless, reactionary, or hysterical to me. All too often, the track and surface are cited as the core issue as opposed to looking at overall horse health as the first issue which is of course a more difficult issue and leads to accountability which is ultimately what we want in the game.

I agree completely with your points here which is why the call for immediate press-release meetings between the horsemen's group and the NYRA management team seems hollow.
Scott..

No offense re: blather but it's just what came out in response to the posts and in association with the assorted social media suggestions/imperatives I'm seeing.

Specific to the NYTHA statement, you seemed particularly aghast at what was hardly a deferral to the track surface given this perfectly equitable Violette quote: "There may not be one right answer, but we will use every avenue possible and examine every angle to address this situation. Everything will be on the table, from finding an independent track surface expert to come in and examine the inner track to a thorough reexamination of every procedure and protocol in place before a horse leaves the starting gate"

That could hardly be characterized as a response limited to possible track surface issues. It covers everything that can be involved from entry box to starting gate to the running of a race. Basically, everything the task force covered in 2012.

As to "public statements" from trainers, what exactly do you think they will have to say minutes after losing a client's or their own horse? Do you think that any trainer in NY or anywhere else sends out horses they deem iffy to get around that day? Until a necropsy reveals the specifics of a fatality, the trainer may very well be as in the dark as the track/state vet that watched it jog earlier in the day and gave it the OK to run. So it is absolutely pointless, reactionary and hysterical to call for trainer press conferences to 'explain' a breakdown.

You say the statements from horseman and NYRA ring hollow, but what are they supposed to say other than 'we'll keep examining every aspect of operations and try to limit possible at-risk horses from running'? They're already doing that.

Everyone needs to be as vigilant as possible from horsemen/owners, to state regulatory vets, to track surface management.. But here's the rub. No matter how well all do their jobs, horses are going to break down and die. We want as few to die as possible, but it's still going to happen. Accept it as a basic tenant of the sport, or don't. But to rashly point fingers and call for sky-is-falling emergency measures solves nothing and only adds to an atmosphere of ignorance and derision.
__________________
All ambitions are lawful except those which climb upward on the miseries or credulities of mankind. ~ Joseph Conrad
A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right. ~ Thomas Paine
Don't let anyone tell you that your dreams can't come true. They are only afraid that theirs won't and yours will. ~ Robert Evans

Last edited by Kasept : 01-10-2015 at 02:17 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:40 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.