No Shame

[jnunan4759]

NYRA Stewards DQ on what they've let go for years. No Frigging Shame. Hypocrites. They made their own bed and they can sleep in it. They let all these bad practices go.

Was it a DQ in the CCA ? it was Iffy. But there were 147 clear DQ's since Jan 1 they let slide. Shame on them. One call can not make them right. Boo.

Trying to upright their upside-down turnip truck at Saratoga is the most stupid thing the stewards could do. They are going to alienate the racing public who are used (right or wrong) to how they do (and not do) things. BEL and AQU are the places to make corrections, not SAR. Clear out the problems before SAR.

Somebody is going to get hurt really bad or worse out there. Raj has got 6 months in rehab and probably will lose most of a year. Reuben gets 7 days. What is fair about that ?

[pointman]

This makes no sense. The call was correct. Sure they have let herding go on way too many times without a proper call, but it is counterintuitive to jump all over the stewards when they actually do the right thing.

Seems like sour grapes to me, clearly you must have had a bet on the 8.

[Big Peps]

Originally Posted by pointman

This makes no sense. The call was correct. Sure they have let herding go on way too many times without a proper call, but it is counterintuitive to jump all over the stewards when they actually do the right thing.

Seems like sour grapes to me, clearly you must have had a bet on the 8.

I had a $10 pick 3 with a single on the 8 would have paid me $8,300 but it was clearly the right call, 100%. When she got taken down so did my profit, singled chatterbox because I love the horse and didn't see her losing obviously. That said as a horse owner not a horse player I was glad they made the right call, good for them. I do agree though at aqueduct on a Thursday afternoon she probably stays up as they say in nascar rubbing is racing...but good call.

[NavalOrange]

The bump obviously cost the three the win, but JV could have kept his horse a few paths outside of the 8. If you bring your horse in close quarters, you run the risk of a bump as the horse tires.

[jms62]

Originally Posted by jnunan4759

NYRA Stewards DQ on what they've let go for years. No Frigging Shame. Hypocrites. They made their own bed and they can sleep in it. They let all these bad practices go.

Was it a DQ in the CCA ? it was Iffy. But there were 147 clear DQ's since Jan 1 they let slide. Shame on them. One call can not make them right. Boo.

Trying to upright their upside-down turnip truck at Saratoga is the most stupid thing the stewards could do. They are going to alienate the racing public who are used (right or wrong) to how they do (and not do) things. BEL and AQU are the places to make corrections, not SAR. Clear out the problems before SAR.

Somebody is going to get hurt really bad or worse out there. Raj has got 6 months in rehab and probably will lose most of a year. Reuben gets 7 days. What is fair about that ?

I got taken down for a $20 Ex myself and after my initial typical whining tantrum I have calmed down. If stewards are trying to make a statement that going forward this nonsense will no longer be allowed then these 2 Graded races early in the meet are the perfect place to make that stand. The owners, trainers and jockey's of the horses that were taken down lost significant money because of the take down. Others are now on notice that these tactics will now be punished and significant purse money will be lost. Kudos to the stewarts if this is the case.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by NavalOrange

The bump obviously cost the three the win, but JV could have kept his horse a few paths outside of the 8. If you bring your horse in close quarters, you run the risk of a bump as the horse tires.

So you think that a rider should have to alter his course from a straight path and the best opportunity to win in compliance with the rules to keep his horse straight on the oft chance that another horse is going to tire and come out? You realize that if JV takes his horse out he almost certainly loses the race, right?

The lack of logic sometimes thrown out here is mind boggling to me.

[NavalOrange]

Originally Posted by pointman

So you think that a rider should have to alter his course from a straight path and the best opportunity to win in compliance with the rules to keep his horse straight on the oft chance that another horse is going to tire and come out? You realize that if JV takes his horse out he almost certainly loses the race, right?

The lack of logic sometimes thrown out here is mind boggling to me.

No what I am saying is that if JV stays a few paths wider the bump would not have occurred. JV did not come down the stretch straight but had angled over a bit to engage the 8. A good and acceptable way to ride. However if you choose to do that, should you benefit (get the win via DQ) from a bump from a tiring horse. Like it has been said on the board before in NASCAR, they call that "just racing". Its not like the 8 was hit left handed and veered out. Quite the oppoiste as she was being aggressively hit right handed. And to rip me for logic, when I don't think anyone on this board can find consistent logic in how stewards apply DQ's is more mind boggling.

[JimmyEllis]

Originally Posted by pointman

So you think that a rider should have to alter his course from a straight path and the best opportunity to win in compliance with the rules to keep his horse straight on the oft chance that another horse is going to tire and come out? You realize that if JV takes his horse out he almost certainly loses the race, right?

The lack of logic sometimes thrown out here is mind boggling to me.

All these riders are looking for an advantage. JV doesn't need to take his horse wide but he also doesn't need to crowd the other horse. Especially since there were no other horses on that part of the track. It got to the point where the other jock couldn't execute his regular whipping motion. JV got the desired result. He seems to be at his bravest when riding for Pletcher. When his next spill happens, however, his sympathy cards will have been exhausted.

[pointman]

JV was in the 2 path the entire stretch on a straight course whipping his horse left handed, it was I'm a Chatterbox who came out. Include Betty was out 1 path next to Danette behind the 3 and 8 and there was no contact there.

Really at a loss as to what JV should have done, he rode his horse hard and would have won the race if Geroux can keep his horse straight. If JV moves his horse out he likely loses. Geroux is in the wrong here, not JV.

[MaTH716]

Neither jock did anything wrong and suggesting JV should've rode different and gone wide to be safe is ridiculous. Geroux didnt heard IMO, he was just along for the ride on a filly that got tired and drifted. Unfortunately for him, she drifted a bit too much near the wire and it was enough to warrant a DQ.

[pointman]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

Neither jock did anything wrong and suggesting JV should've rode different and gone wide to be safe is ridiculous. Geroux didnt heard IMO, he was just along for the ride on a filly that got tired and drifted. Unfortunately for him, she drifted a bit too much near the wire and it was enough to warrant a DQ.

I agree Matt, I should have been a bit more clear, but I don't think Geroux did anything wrong either. He was hitting his horse right handed and the horse came out on her own. I don't think it was his fault that he could not keep the horse straight but the horse interfered which warranted a DQ. I don't think Geroux deserves any penalty for something I seriously doubt he expected or could control.

[JimmyEllis]

The filly got tired and drifted but JV was right up on her and Geroux couldn't whip as freely as he'd have wanted. In fact he came very close to hitting Curalina with his whip. If it's a requirement that tired horses run straight in the stretch, then add lanes and dq those coming out of them. If not, then allow them to drift a path and don't give the benefit to jocks that crowd them. If a jock can't freely whip a tired horse he shouldn't be punished.
They allow all that herding and they take down horses that drift a path.

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by JimmyEllis

The filly got tired and drifted but JV was right up on her and Geroux couldn't whip as freely as he'd have wanted. In fact he came very close to hitting Curalina with his whip. If it's a requirement that tired horses run straight in the stretch, then add lanes and dq those coming out of them. If not, then allow them to drift a path and don't give the benefit to jocks that crowd them. If a jock can't freely whip a tired horse he shouldn't be punished.
They allow all that herding and they take down horses that drift a path.

JV was straight as an arrow and going left handed. I dont think he tried to purposely crowd Geroux. It was just unfortunate that Chatterbox really got out at the wire (despite Geroux being right handed the entire length of the stretch), obviously that was the reason for the DQ.

I understand the herding argument, but I really feel like it's a totally separate argument. This was just interference near the wire with a horse that lost a head bob.

[NavalOrange]

Originally Posted by pointman

I agree Matt, I should have been a bit more clear, but I don't think Geroux did anything wrong either. He was hitting his horse right handed and the horse came out on her own. I don't think it was his fault that he could not keep the horse straight but the horse interfered which warranted a DQ. I don't think Geroux deserves any penalty for something I seriously doubt he expected or could control.

I just re-watched the head on and you are right JV horse did come down the entire stretch in the two path. I saw it differently watching the replay yesterday on the infield big screen as it looked like JV was out more off the rail. But I still point out that by choosing the two path down the stretch brings a risk when passing a willing yet tiring horse. So JV initiates the risk and when that risk is realized, he benefits.

[JimmyEllis]

While JV enters sticking righty, he is desperately going lefty late stretch and can't get his filly to move out a path. Geroux sticks righty till very late, where it appears that he lacks room to continue; at this point, his filly comes out, bumps and is thrown to left lead. If she has a single path to her right, there's no issue

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by JimmyEllis

While JV enters sticking righty, he is desperately going lefty late stretch and can't get his filly to move out a path. Geroux sticks righty till very late, where it appears that he lacks room to continue; at this point, his filly comes out, bumps and is thrown to left lead. If she has a single path to her right, there's no issue

But then, wouldnt JV nip her at the wire anyway?

[RHT2004]

Originally Posted by Big Peps

I had a $10 pick 3 with a single on the 8 would have paid me $8,300 but it was clearly the right call, 100%. When she got taken down so did my profit, singled chatterbox because I love the horse and didn't see her losing obviously. That said as a horse owner not a horse player I was glad they made the right call, good for them. I do agree though at aqueduct on a Thursday afternoon she probably stays up as they say in nascar rubbing is racing...but good call.

$10 pick 3, with the nearly impossible winner of the 9f dirt race?
You must be very sharp. Rough beat, but like you said it was the right call.

[Big Peps]

Originally Posted by RHT2004

$10 pick 3, with the nearly impossible winner of the 9f dirt race?
You must be very sharp. Rough beat, but like you said it was the right call.

If you could see the trail of tears I left behind at Saratoga over the weekend you would think otherwise. Didn't have any success. I wasn't there but heading up Friday. Went 5 deep in the 9f race, got lucky with the winner, singled Saez in 9th and singled chatterbox as well figuring Jones would have her ready off the short layoff. He did and I was damn close.