Lava Man

[Bobby Fischer]

WO and TP are closer to dirt in speed and kindness to front-runners, but the dynamics of the race are much different.
At WO and TP the kickback is so bad that horses usually run three wide on the lead and generally race outside. Saving ground on the rail as in a dirt race will guarantee a trachea full of junk.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by miraja2

Yes, and I agree that that is rather unfortunate. I wish they wouldn't run BC races on that stuff, BUT as I said earlier, it is important to remember that Santa Anita and Del Mar aren't going to play the same way simply because they both have polytrack. I think it is fair to assume that they will be breaking 2:07 in next year's BCC.

isn't santa anita going with cushion track??? that's what hollywood has...hate to be difficult, but all artificial surfaces are NOT polytrack-which is a brand name. much like tapeta, or of course cushion--which horsemen liked just fine at hollywood.

or maybe everyone can just hire hollywoods track super and crew!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

That is what would make sense. I don't think anyone expected that they would get it exactly right from the start. But the comments from Harper that he wasn't going to do anything to the track till after the meet were irresponsible, IMO. I think that they should listen to the concerns of the horsemen and tinker around with it during the meet, like the other tracks have done, to get it to a consistent level. But it's like they don't want to admit that it's not totally maintenance free. It feels like if they admit that, they think they would be admitting failure and that's just not the case. It's a work in progress and should be treated as such.

didn't hollywood encourage horsemen to let them know how the track seemed? who better to ask, and what better time to make adjustments then training time--not once the meet opens!

[whodey17]

Originally Posted by philcski

You don't get it, do you?

It has nothing to do with the quality of the winner, IMO, who while untested at this level and beaten on the east coast in lower was not much behind the rest of the field besides Lava Man in ability. It has everything to do with the way the race was run and the consistently inconsistent results. there is no way a horse of Lava Man's stature should be staggering down the lane after 6F in nearly 1:15. The track is garbage.

What's interesting to me is I played some Arlington this weekend and it played absolutely fair with a little moisture in the track.

I totally get it. The race was run exactly how every other race has been run at Del Mar. Horses on the lead or near the lead have a difficult time winning the race. The consistency in Del Mar is that right now it seems to be inconsistent. Turfway and Keeneland were inconsistant at first, but with some good notes and some good data one can make money at Del Mar in the future. I could care less what time the race was clocked in, as long as my selection comes in first.

I do agree with you that there should be some moisture put into these synthetic surfaces.

[sumitas]

It's the same track for all. I don't see a need for moisture, that's a waste of water. The times are a relative thing. Only relative to Del Mar, not other tracks.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by sumitas

It's the same track for all. I don't see a need for moisture, that's a waste of water. The times are a relative thing. Only relative to Del Mar, not other tracks.

Some horses can run on the shiat and some can't. That was pretty obvious.

[smuthg]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

Some horses can run on the shiat and some can't. That was pretty obvious.

Agreed... I've had nothing but respect for him since the Pacific Classic in '04... That's the type of race that ends most "good" horses career, and he's won I think 6 Grade 1's since then...

shut out test.

[Echo Farm]

http://www.drf.com/news/article/87781.html

[Rags]

The DM track is just fine. There's a winner in every race.
The usual losers are crying and whining as always. What else is new?

"Time" is for the Swiss in case anyone is interested.

As for Lava Man, put a fork in he's done.

That was Hello Sunday's best race. He hasn't got anymore than that. Never saw the 2nd horse on the far outside. It didn't really matter, he wouldn't have beaten the winner if the Red Sea opened.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by Danzig

isn't santa anita going with cushion track??? that's what hollywood has.

Yes, which was basically the point I was trying to make to "Bobby Fischer" before. Just because Santa Anita has artificial and Del Mar has artificial doesn't mean that the '08 BC is going to look like this meet at Del Mar (thankfully). Even each polytrack plays differently, and the difference between cushion and poly seem substantial. Just ask AP Xcellent and Lava Man.

[ELA]

Tough crowd -- a real tough crowd, LOL.

Eric

[gamblin4ever]

Looking @ the PP's of the Pacific Classic, with the exception of Lava Man, none of the other horses impressed me enough to truly rule out any of them out. Here are some items I noticed of the other runners.

0 winners @ distance (LM 6 of 9)
3 GSW, (no G1's) of these 3 only Awesome Gem(2nd) has ran @ the dist.
5 has Beyered in the 100s w/ the tops being on dirt or cushion track.
Arson Squad w/106 BSF is much better on dirt.
Awesome Gem (105) top is on dirt also.

If you could rule out Lava Man on the win,the race then becomes wide open.
Looking @ the replay SC started his run earlier than AG did, and AG almost caught him.
SC just looked like a new horse on poly.

The race looked like most others on the West Coast, 1 big horse running against lower quality and he didnt fire his best.

Look @ Street Sense, he lost on polytrack and seems to favor a deeper dirt surface to run on. Unless there is a change, I won't have him on my win ticket in the BC @ Monmouth since its a speed favoring track which doesn't suit his running style.